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Chinese Kenpo Karate Scandal! I’ve heard many tales of many martial arts that were, shall we say, less than honorable, but the one I heard about Chinese Kenpo Karate, however, is one of the worst I have heard. Unfortunately, I don’t know how true it is, but with the information I present in this article perhaps some one could let me know if they have any light to shed on the truth or falsity of it. Ed Parker is credited with being the creator of modern Kenpo, putting on the biggest tournament in the world for years, the Internationals, teaching movie stars, including Elvis, and all manner of other deeds. His prowess is quite well known, and his students are legion.
Unfortunately, when he first began teaching, while he seemed to demonstrate a talent as a teacher, he was only a brown belt. In those days he was actually teaching the Heian forms from Shotokan karate, this as illustrated by one of his earliest books. Running out of material to teach his students, he went back to Hawaii and was told to go take a hike, the founder of the system apparently had lost interest in him as a student.
I’m not sure, exactly, what the fall out was, but it was perhaps that Ed was teaching without permission. Ed then ran into a fellow in San Francisco named Jimmy Woo, whose named might have been Jimmy Wu, who knew tremendous and authentic gung fu, but who spoke almost no English.
Ed brought Jimmy to Los Angeles, where they lived together, and where Jimmy devised the Kenpo forms, the techniques, and so on. Ed took these forms and techniques and began teaching them as his own. To complicate matters further, Ed asked Jimmy to write a book with him on what they were doing, and Jimmy spent his days writing kenpo, teaching Ed and some of his students, all while still being deficient in the English language. One day Jimmy saw a rough translation/draft of the book that Ed was planning on turning over to a publisher, and he was surprised to see that his name was not on the cover, or anywhere in the book. This was surprising, because even though Ed was half the team, Jimmy was doing all the work. Why not my name on book, is what he was supposed to have said.
Ed said he would explain, but he had an errand to run, could they take a drive, and Ed would explain on the way. Jimmy got into the car, and Ed drove into Hollywood, but Ed didn’t say a word about the book the whole time. On Hollywood Blvd, there is an Armenian pastry shop there now, Ed let Jimmy out of the car, and drove off.
Jimmy had one single quarter in his pocket, the clothes on his back, and nothing else. With that last quarter he called one of Ed’s students, who he had been teaching. In his broken English he explained what Ed had done, that he didn’t know where he was, or why it had all happened. He had been teaching, writing, and then, he had been betrayed.
Now, is this story true, or is it a pack of lies? If anybody has definite information on this story, I sure would like to know. This page has been about Chinese Kenpo Karate. <A HREF=”Widgets</A>. Per the article, the person Jimmy Woo called was my father, George Cadinha, and yeah, they left Ed. They kept Jimmy in Los Angeles, and they include: Rich Montgomery, Bart Volk, Dick Trausell, Rick Flores, Ted Tabura, Larry Hall, Bones (can’t recall his name), Gus Hoefling, and of course my father, yep, truth!
They pooled their money, and rented the Hollywood Mausoleum, and a few of them couldn’t afford it, so they gave up their apts., and slept in the embalming room, truth, yep! Can you say commitment? After a few years, actor James Hong helped them move to a better facility, also on Hollywood Blvd. No embalming room, haha! Later, after my father and the others trailed off, due to marriage, family, etcthe new students were ushered in, and Jimmy moved to Winona Blvd., off of Hollywood Blvd.
His students built him a huge structure in his backyard, to teach. Mayor Tom Bradley declared it a church of sorts; it was an interesting ceremony Jimmy passed away in 2o14, but we still celebrate his birthday in China Town, Los Angeles, and hopefully will continue to do so for years to come! Parker learned Hawaiian Kempo from William CHow in the 1950’s. Hawaiian Kempo was a traditional Okinawan karate do system brought to Hawaii. He wanted to modernize the system which was, at the time, a traditional rendition of what could never be mistaken for applicable fighting techniques. Parker attempted to upgrade the old-school form into street-applicable science.
He failed miserably. While his American Kenpo techniques did make a huge improvement in technical use, they held onto the traditional karate form that has failed so many people in so many fights. The result is an army of kenpo systems that study high-level techniques in front of a mirror, in simulated scenarios, and instructor prompted reactions. The martial artists never become fighters. When they do spar, they use none of what is taught in kenpo.
Instead, they revert to kickboxing-like tactics. When you study through two or three v ersions of the system, it becomes apparent that Bruce Lee’s JKD Trapping influenced the development somehow.
There is, however, very little Chinese influence in the system. Parker applied the trapping inspirations with a traditional karate body motion. His claim to Chinese ancestry is, at best, third generation; inherited from the old Okinawan karate do systems like Goju Ryu Karate Do. I have been a dedicated martial artist for 25 years. I started in the modern kenpo systems such as Ed Parker’s Original Kenpo System, Action Kenpo Karate, and a couple of others. I have also studied on the traditional Okinawan side, and the traditional korean side. In order for something to become Chinese in origin, it must adapt a CHinese body motion.
For instance, a Japanese Karate Master cannot go to China and pass himself off as a Kung Fu Master; the body motions are completely different. There have been a few since Parker who achieved his goal for him. CHinese Kenpo and Mong Su Dom Tai Chinese Karate managed to set up mirror systems that incorporated Kung Fu and Indonesian body motion into their new generation techniques. When they move they look like Silat, Tai Chi, WIng Chun, and Chow Gar masters who are influenced by Wudan, Wushu, and/or Shaolin.
As a final thought, if all traditional systems would eliminate the katas and set techniques from their systems, after extracting all the basic movements, and then teach and practice those movements the way a prize fighter does, most systems would develop high levels of applicability. Practical theory and proof of practicality are not the same thing. No second hand information can prepare you for a first hand confrontation.-Bruce Lee •. And I agree with you on the forms.
If you removed them. Or just used them for competition and taught actual application of the technique you would have very practical fighters. In a ring or on the street and yes you are 100% right you can tell a Chinese Kenpo master and an Okinawan Kenpo master apart even if they switched uniforms. One will move the body smoother and one will look more forceful.
I am sure you know which by the way I describe. I don’t want to say Which I prefer because I respect anyone who takes years to devote to an art, and pour their blood sweat and tears into it. I started training with Sifu James Wing Woo in 1977 and he is like a second father to me. That story of Parker and Sifu is essentially true regarding the book, but he went on to build a successful practice and a dedicated group of students. He always teaches the classes himself, 363 days a year. Sifu Woo just celebrated his 90th birthday Sept 2012, and he is still teaching Kung Fu and Tai Chi daily from his gym in Hollywood CA (and the workouts are still tough!). Some good links for more info: This recent book from Sifu Woo is filled with wisdom and his experience Give yourself a gift and stop by the gym and take some classes from Sifu.
Best, Bill Nadal •. It makes me sick when I hear how big and bad Ed Parker was.
As much respect as I may have for Parker’ s work in bringing it to the masses, I lost quite a bit when I heard through very reliable sources that he linked out of a fight with boxer Milo Savage. Instead, Parker went and begged Gene La Bell to take the fight.
Why did Parker refuse the challenge? He claims to have done some backyard boxing and that along with his size should have been a plus. Fact is that Savage a brutal launcher would have cleaned Parkers clock. Savage was a little over the hill, but as Ray Mercer proved when he put UFC chump Tim Sylvia to sleep, old or not a boxer can retain punching power well into his 50’sGeorge Foreman who? I knew Milio Savage very well. He was my boxing coach while I was training in Martial Art to earn my BB. We had many conversations over lunch and a brisket.
They sicked La Bell on him and made him wear a go top. BTWGene had a lot of friends who were, you know like the guys in the Sopranos. A lot of intimidation. La Bell won hands down, but the big bad Hawaiian, the creator of American kenpo the great Ed Parker refused to accept the challenge, that’s a fact.
There is a famous statement that applies here, “Better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than speak (or post) and remove all doubt.” Unfortunately for you, Monfongo, I was there at the fight. And I was the one who contacted Ed Parker about the challenge. EVERYTHING YOU POSTED IS PURE CRAP! Here are the facts: * No one challenged Ed Parker.
* The braggart challenge was to ANY martial artist. Because Savage was in Salt Lake I wanted to accept it. * I called Ed Parker in California to get his permission.
He laughed out loud and asked me not to do so (He didn’t want Savage killed). Still chuckling, he said he’d ask his friend Gene Lebell to accept.
I was disappointed but out of respect I agreed. The idea of Parker refusing a challenge is ridiculous and anyone who passes on these lies is an ASS. (For your information: TRUTH – Ed Parker was a “Bralah,” he grew up on the streets of Honolulu as a street fighter.
After he developed his version of Kenpo he was in seven serious fights in his life. (a “serious” fight to Ed Parker was four or more armed attackers; clubs, knives, tire irons, bottles, etc.
THE LONGEST OF THOSE FIGHTS LASTED 7 SECONDS!) Kenpo, as Ed Parker restructured it, was not a sport, it was not a game it was LIFE AND DEATH; The QUICK & THE DEAD!) * The night of the fight at the Salt Lake Fairgrounds, Savage entered the ring wearing heavy bag gloves ( the kind that have a heavy plastic insert over the knuckles). I personally complained to the referee. Gene laughed it off and said, “Let him wear brass knuckles if he wants.” * The fight was a total mismatch.
LeBell toyed with Savage, pretended to have been hurt by a couple of body shots; and then stepped behind Savage and used the gi top to execute a scarf strangle. Savage was out in seconds. * They had difficulty in reviving Savage so I ripped off his right (black) boxing shoe and performed Kuatsu which brought him around. I am sick of hearing these phony stories from punks who never really knew my friend and brother. Unfortunately for them, there are still a few of us greybeards who are still around who were there and can set the record straight. Here is another FACT.
You can’t make yourself taller but attempting to tear down the reputation of giants. I started with Ed Parker in 1954 when he was still at BYU. He was not only my only instructor, through the decades he became my friend and brother. Mills Crenshaw •.
Crenshaw, Thank you for stepping in the digital internet ring and keeping the record straight. I sadly never met Ed Parker, but I have met my share of his students and trained with them, such as Mike Pick, Huk Planas, Lee Wedlake, Skip Hancock, and more at the seminar/camp level, and private lessons with Mr. All of them said, Mr. Parker was the Alpha male in the room during those days. I can’t imagine Mr. Parker backing down, thanks for confirming none of this happened. Salute, Steve Shaffer Tallahassee, FL •.
Crenshaw, Loved reading your reply. I’m a student of Greg Payne in Chuck Sullivan and Vic LeRoux’s IKCA system. I’m interested in more stories of Ed and those around that time period if you wouldn’t mind sharing some with me. I love passing these stories on to my students.
Chuck and Vic also love telling stories. Is your name Mills Crenshaw or a nickname? I thought Crenshaw was the name of a street where one of the dojo’s was located. We have a technique called Crenshaw High Five. Hope to get in touch with you. Much Respect.
Thank god someone out there is speaking some truth, there really is so much BS on the internet about Mr. Parker and it’s ridiculous. I’ve been looking around and it’s pretty much the same negative story about how ” he ran out of material” and was no longer recognized by Mr.
Looks to me like this was a false story perpetuated by the Tracy brothers.. They got the axe because they were misrepresenting the ideals of the system.
What did they do? They started a story they gave them the “good lighting”. Back in the day much of the good bits of the system were hidden so you could not misuse it and guess what, none of the Tracy guys fully understand the system lol! Suckers jokes on you. Even in death Mr. Parker had his way.
Parker has plenty of material available on Amazon if you interested in the real story. Ed was a fraud. I was at his school for 6 years, and in that time he taught two times and they weren’t even the full 2 hours.
One serious question comes from Ed’s own credentials. Mills Crenshaw has presented us with Ed’s black belt certificate from William K.S. Why from Mills? Why not from Ed Jr.
Or his wife Lelani? In the 60s we asked to see Ed’s certificate. He said he didn’t know where it was. But the one presented by Mills Crenshaw says Ed is a shodan or 1st. Degree black belt.
So where did Ed get all the degrees leading up to his 10th. And many say Ed never got a black, but rather his highest belt was hrown. So let’s get to the “real Ed Parker.” I trained at the West Los Angeles school, sometimes referred to as the “Santa Monica” school as it was on Santa Monica Blvd. I trained Monday through Friday in the afternoons and evening classes, and then went in on Saturday, which is when Dan Inosanto taught. So I basically lived there. I used to train with Larry Hartsell when he came in on Saturdays, and GOD was that an experience. Classes there were taught on Tuesday and Thursday by Scott Loring- a truly PHENOMENAL fighter.
The Monday-Wednesday class was taught by “Stormin Norman Pattiz.” Not even close to Scott’s level but a very competent teacher. And Norm even developed a couple of really good techniques- one called the “high five” and the other the “back knuckle five.” After Scott left his classes were taken over by Russ Fineman.
Russ was a small man- but he cut his teeth sparring with Scott Loring. Russ was like 5’6″ and 135, Scott was 6 feet tall and 210. Russ fought like a cross between a game cock and a cat. After Russ left Paul Dalton took over the classes on Tuesday-Thursday, and Paul has a deep seated hate for Ed Parker due to Ed totally screwing him over. The reason for this little history lesson is point something out- you never see any reference to Ed PArker teaching.
And all his classes at Pasadena, the home school were taught by people like Frank Trejo, Dave Hebler or others. Now the plot thickens. One of Ed’s teachers, Robert Libby, had left the school and was teaching at a health club. So Robert got inot a verbal arguemnt with a PArker green belt. The green belt was bad mouthing Paul Dalton, a very good friend and teacher of Robert’s, so Bob finally told the guy to shit up and walked.
The green belt called ed and told him that Robert had torn up his black belt certificate in front of the entire gym, urinated on it and said “Ed PArker isn’t shit.” Ed Believed it and called the health club. He told the owner “Bob goes or I come down there and start hurting people.” So the guy told Robert he had to leave. And Robert was a key figure in rebuilding Ed’s schools after Ed was closed down by the IRS, told Ed he would teach for free until the schools got back on their feetm and repainted and washed down 3 of Ed’s schools for free. And can you oimagine a guy urinating in public in a posh Westwood health club? That is how Ed Parker pays back those that are loyal to him. Ed was a scumbag, a thief, a liar, a fraud, and I beklieve mentally ill.
So did Robert take this lying down? He called Ed at his house from the phone of Tom Bleecker.
He told Ed “when and where do you want to fight?’ (I do not know all the exact details of this exchange, but I do know that Tom Bleecker and Gary Brandoliono were there). A few hours later Lelani called Robert at home and said “please don’t kill my husband! He has a very bad heart and could die if he fights.” So this is why Ed never trained and never did much of anything. He was nothing but a fat-mouthed coward.
And as one last note- if you are studying Ed Parker’s American Karate you are throwing your money away. The techniques are crap and canot work in a real fight. As many others have mentioned, why isn’t there one video of a Kenpo being used in a real fight? Because they are a fraud and do not work, just like their creator.
I knew the truth would come out. Parker was to a degree “hype” more than skill. He used to create techniques and carry them around on index cards. Instead of training, he’s writing stuff most that doesn’t work. Listen, the man has passed and maybe these things should have been brought up when he was alive, but the truth must be made public. Every Parker kenpoist I’ve seen spar or fight never uses the system techniques. Now, kajukenbo guys those are different animals.
Most can fight and a great majority have pretty decent boxing skills. Parker did a lot to popularize and promote the arts, but on a skill-fight- condition level he was not up to par. Just my 2 cents. My friend “Willy” Shakespeare said it best: “Hark, hark how the dogs do bark; the beggars are coming to town.” These fictional tales about Ed Parker are, as “Willy” would put it, are: “a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying NOTHING!” Most martial artists have never been in a serious fight in their life. Ed Parker had seven that I know of. (See my response to Monfongo for the definition of a “Serious fight.) Ron and Vito you are very brave to bad mouth “The Old Man” now that he’s gone. I don’t know you, you must be young bucks to so ignorantly shoot your mouths off.
I’m 77 so I’m sure you would be far more than a match for me; and I was only trained in the hard school by Ed Parker whom you consider a fraud so I’m sure my poor skills are no match for your exalted expertise. However, if you would like to visit Salt Lake I would be happy to drag my weary bones on the matt and let you show me the error of my ways. We can use the studio facilities of one of my students, Tony Martinez at 4654 West 3500 South.
Or perhaps you would prefer to workout with Tony, he’s 5′ 3,” white haired and only age 62 and he too was trained be me in what you consider to be a “fraudulent” system. Either of us would be happy to entertain youbring your lunch. Cordially, Mills Crenshaw •.
What these MMA fans don’t understand is that Ed Parker was in the process of helping others begin dojos, promoting Kenpo in America, working in films as an actor/fight coordinator, Elvis body guard etc. When would a man as busy as Ed Parker be able to teach regularly? There are many bad schools, that is obvious and backed up by videos on youtube. There are also great schools that are ran by black belts who devoted their entire lives to Karate. Don’t get me wrong, MMA produces incredible prize fighters that study martial arts! Imagine what these MMA fighters(who devote their lives to different Martial art principles would do outside of a ring to someone without a cup, referee, mouthguard, gloves, and a padded cage.
That is when you would see Karate in action, not in a tournament governed by rules concerning the safety of the fighters. Mills, as part of a job I had for the city cleaning drunks and druggies off the streets, putting them in a paddy wagon, and dropping them off at jail to sober up, I’ve been in lots of serious fights with grown men. Unfortunately for us, to present a more “helpful” image the city did not allow us any weapons or restraints (e.g. We were only permitted a flashlight of any size or design we chose.
I studied Kenpo for awhile too. So I’ll clear it up for you right now very simply–American Kenpo does NOT work in a real fight. I know from experience. In a real fight, a guy doesn’t throw a low speed punch and hold it there while you work your 15 different counter moves on him–and that’s what you’d need for that joke of a system to work. Parker trained Elvis Prestley and Elvis even earned his black belt from Parker. Have you ever seen Elvis’s karate?
You’ll be embarrassed for him. I hope you never have to defend yourself using your Kenpo techniques because you’ll get hurt or killed. Dear Mills, You are so full of crap- to be blunt. Why wouldn’t Ed fight Robert Libby?
Ed was like 42 and Robert was 21. OK, Ed was older, but why did Lelani call for Ed? Why did Ed duck the Milo Savage fight? Why did Larry Hartsell call Ed a “Kenpo clown.” Why did Ed never train, compete, or teach? You say he had 7 street fights- you are a liar.
And against 4 o 5 armed attackers- now who is the liar and fool Mills? If you know anything about fighting, you know that 1 armed attacker can be serious. But 4 to 5 with “knives and clubs”- man you can sling the BS.
Ed never fought anybody as he would have dropped dead. Lelani begged Robert Libby not to “kill my husband.” She knew his heart was very bad- look at how he died. So you can quote the noble bard all you want- Ed was an out of shape wind bag, liar, thief, and a fraud.
He never got a black belt from Chow, was promoted to 5th. Degree by his cronies, and then promoted again to 10th.
Degree by cronyism. Just look at the videos he is in- he looks HORRIBLE!!!! We never knew he was that pathetic as he NEVER did anything. He came in, talked a little bit, took the money, and went home. And if you think Ed looks good in these videos you know less than nothing about martial arts or fighting, which is obviously the case as you state that Ed didn’t think it was a real fight unless against 4 to 5 armed attackers. The thing we are glad about is that hits on this site have sky-rocketed, and exposing Ed and Kenpo for the fraud that it is may save somebody from getting clobbered. So Mills, curl up with a good book after you put on your Spider Man PJs and fantasize as to how great Ed and Kenpo are- you are a fool and liar like your mentor.
You are right. Ed Parker was an obvious fraud. One need not have known him to be aware of that. His disgrace is in his videos. Look at what he did on that Lucy show – I thought all the negative things I heard about him were just sour grapes – until I saw that. But please do not knock true Kenpo.
American Kenpo – Ed Parker’s hoax – and Chu’an Fa Chinese Kenpo are two very different things. As I understood it, Ed Parker broke off from an art – not Kenpo, but Kempo – after learning far too little to do what he eventually did.
Creating a fabricated art with a stolen name, and declaring himself a Super Grand Master. Early on, Ed Parker wore a white gi, as Kempo Karateka do. He changed it to black and completed the theft from Chu’an Fa by taking the look as well. But he did not steal the art – he did not have the skill to mimic it. While this post is is not directed at the late Ed Parker I have to say that I find any statement made by a person or third party saying that a martial artist took out 4 to 5 armed attackers as beyond any reasonable belief.
The only time I have heard of anything coming close to this was a corroborated (by multiple people who were present) account of a Japanese Wado-Ryu 4th Dan instructor back in the 1960’s who I shall not mention by name. He took out four large guys in rapid succession but they were all unarmed. They were all laid out like road kills!
He would always advocated that we should get into street fights to put our skills to the test. I recall one week our own instructor turning up to run the class (He was around 6′ 4″ or so) and he looked as though he had gone through a car windshield. He told me that he had been sparring with this Japanese instructor. Our instructor was a regional champion! As I read your post I actually laughed. I had this mental picture of a Chihuahua yapping at a Great Dane.
You sir are a childish fool and I dismiss you without argument. To those who are serious researchers and are interested in historic fact rather than inane bluster, I refer you to Master of the arts Ted Sumner, now a Kenpo Tenth Dan. Ted, whom I am honored to call friend, Is a true Warrior.
There is no infantile blather about whether or not his Kenpo was “real,” whether or not he could actually defend himself IF attacked. As a twenty-three year old Vietnam vet (He looked like he was only 17) he went under Deep Cover in the life and death world of narcotics trafficking. For him, Kenpo was not a game, a sport, or an art; it was Life and Death. Kenpo saved Ted Sumner’s life on numerous occasions and at that time he was only a third Dan. Ask Ted Sumner about Ed Parker. The yapping of these know-nothing puppies is, and should be dismissed as, the drunken mouthings of adolescents. But Ted Sumner is a blooded warrior.
He was attacked, with intent to kill, by murderers, gang members and multiple armed attackers. His assessment you can take to the bank. He’s been there and his Kenpo is vouchsafed in blood. Ask him what he thinks of Ed Parker and what his opinion is of those who are now trying to tarnish his reputation. If you really care you can read Ted Sumner’s documented history in the book, “Deep Cover Cop.” Ted is now a white haired “greybeard;” but don’t make the mistake of assuming he no longer has the skill or the passion. That blunder could cost you the use of an arm, a leg; or your life. Yes, we all grow older.
Just before his death Ed Parker had white hair and had put on weight. But he was the Master of the art of Kenpo. He was a true warrior. The pathetic clowns who try to besmirch his memory will never know what he knew because they only run their mouths Ed Parker engaged his brain. Ask Ted Sumner what he thought of Ed Parker. As for you Ron Morgan, years ago I wrote this poem which was included in Ed Parker’s tribute to Elvis.
It fits you perfectly: “The Jackals:” The muffled drums are silent now, but ere the dirge could fade; a louder cadence drowned them out, an ugly new parade. Artless hangers-on typed out a never ending stream, of fact-less books and manuscripts and each one had this theme: “You should not love the King now dead, he lived ignobly, glory for valiant deeds if ought, the praise belongs to me!” The jackals gather round the crypt, and sniff the fetid air for hints of gold and favors that live no longer there. With empty bellies and empty minds they rummage through the roans then snap their jaws and lift their legs and gnaw their master’s bones; then skulk away for fitful naps in reason’s darkened lair, to dream of gold and favors that live no longer there. Mills Crenshaw •. Tom Bleecker 4:28 PM (6 hours ago) to me It’s a complete mystery to me.
Off hand, I can’t recall knowing anyone named Ron Morgan. Also, while I knew Bob Libby, this is the first I’ve heard of Bob challenging Ed Parker to a fight. It might be a good idea to contact Bob and ask him.
Best —–Original Message—– From: Mills Crenshaw To: Tom Bleecker Sent: Tue, Mar 11, 2014 2:00 pm Subject: This Idiot claims Tom, This idiot claims you as a witness to his crazy story. Do you have any first hand knowledge?
From what I’ve been able to gather, the reason you may not have known about this incident is that Bob was known for being loud and clowning around. Most of his story doesn’t hold up unless you understood that. More than likely, he was holding a phone, but it wasn’t connected to anyone as he made his threats while horsing around. If you think hard about his story it doesn’t make sense, he says Mr.
Parker shut his class down, and Bob challenged Mr. Parker to fight over the phone, but later said he didn’t because Mrs. Parker asked him not to.
Nothing of this story can be verified, and it just doesn’t make sense that Mr. Parker would have threatened anyone, while making someone shut down a class yet back away from a fight after being threatened by Bob?
Bob is just a jerk who wants some fame for his videos now. If this story were true, many, many people would have heard about it over the years. Tom, you are a liar. You were in the room with Gary Brandolino when Bob called Ed and chose him off.
And it was Tom that dared Bob to do it. They then had a discussion as to how Bob would fight him. Bob said I’ll run him around for about 10 seconds- when he gasses out I’ll nail him. Just like all cults they are coated in lies and distortions. Just look at the basics- Ed never trained, dropped dead from a massive heart attack, and was warned by Terry Robinson that he would die. Gary Brandolino tells a story of Ed Parker showing up at Tom Bleecker’s wedding.
He was on a cane from gout, could barely get around, and looked like death warmed over. Bob will respond soon. He has assured me that Tom Bleecker is lying. It was in 1973 in Tom Bleecker’s living room in his apartment in Westwood, and Gary Brandilino was also there. I have trained under Bob and he is for real. He has also assured me that one can tell that Mills is an idiot.
Fighting 4 to 5 guys with knives and clubs and beating them all in 7 seconds- BULLSHIT. This from a man that never trained.
This is even far-fetched for Kenpo bullshitters. Mills, I wish you younger to give you the beating you deserve. Hey Tom, this is Robert Libby speaking for himself- YOU ARE A FUCKING LIAR. I was in your apartment with Gary Brandolino You said that there was no way I would choose of Ed. I told you I didn’t know his home phone number.
You said I have it and dialed it for me. I insulted Ed right in front of you and Gary and then chose him off for threatening to beat up my beginning students. I told Ed I would fight him anytime- anyplace. I also told Ed that he was a punk, a thief, and a bully. When I arrived home Lelani called me in tears and begged me not to fight Ed as he had a very bad heart and was near death. I promised her I would not do a sickly man any harm and left it there.
So Tom, are you sickly, senile, or just playing politics like usual? FUCK YOU!!!!!
You know what I am saying is the truth Also, American Kenpo currently has more 10th. Degrees that the Japanese Judo Federation has had in its entire existence. Whose Johnson do you suck to get one?
You give them out like popcorn at a movie. And as for you Mills- how’s your lawsuit? How’s that bankruptcy? I can see how much credibility you have in the business world- as much as you have in martial arts.
Ask Tom Bleecker. Call PFS of Ridgecrest, Calif. And ask who did most of the teaching from 1999 to 2001.
Call No Way Martial Arts in Los Angeles and ask a PFS Full Instuctor named Duane Walden who he used to call Sifu! Ask him who taught the classes in Chico, Calif for 2 years.
See if he respects my abilities. So now Michael Brooks you goddamn coward I think I have proven what my credentials are. Now reveal who you are bitch! But you will never will. You will just crawl back under your rock where you belong! So the Parker legacy? Bad schools with incompetent instructors that just keep continuing the bullshit!
Ed Parker would not fight me because he was all talk and no action. He was a fake who knew how to take advantage of people.
And my track record against Kenpo black belts is 3-0. All backed down and even from a friendly exchange of ideas! Compared to how we trained in the 1960s they wouldn’t be fit to carry our gym bags! Also, I have 12 videos on YouTube. I am not hiding from anybody. You are new here so I will elucidate you.
I challenged Kenpo. You do the grab and I will only resist and do no offensive strikes- I will just resist and defeat virtually the techniques as they do not work. And as I use no offense you must stick to the technique- nobody stepped forward. That’s confidence in your system, There are hundreds of Ed Parker Kenpo people who know me, and most probably do not like hearing this, but it is a failed system from a man who was lazy and knew nothing about martial arts. He made up stories to make an image and then marketed the image.
He never trained, never competed, and rarely taught. In the 6 years I spent at the Santa Monica school he taught maybe two times. He always talked about doing something but never did! Let’s say I know nothing. Here is a little assignment- I want you to produce 1 video of Ed Parker EVER doing anything that could be considered as “working out” or “training.” ED NEVER TRAINED!!
Here is another true story- In about 1969 a Los Angeles TV station called KCOP 13 had a martial arts special. It was hosted by the late Nick Adams. He had a green in Kenpo. Many people were on the 1 hour show- the Urquidez brothers, Ed Parker, and others. So Ed did the “5 count”, or 5 knives. He did it one time and was gasping for air. A second time and he could barely talk, and the 3rd.
Time he was done. My brother, who was older, asked me id Ed was sick. I said “maybe he has the flu.” No, he was done. So in the prime of life Ed could barely do one technique- PATHETIC!!!!
So Mills I’ll be looking for that video real soon!!!! Now many might say “Why is he saying this stuff?’ Simple- I actually care what happens to people that learn martial arts, and it sickens me to see crap pawned off as gold. There are about 10 Kenpo techniques that can work, but only if changed. The reasons for the changes are that Ed was a very flawed technician and knew little about fighting. This was because he never competed; never got his black belt from KS Chow; and never had a real fight.
1 simple fix is that one should not block with the front hand, but rather the back. A martial artist should never train off of a step through reverse punch as nobody throws that punch.
All techniques should be done in real time and with various counters thrown to build reflexes. Non-contact sparring should never be done as it destroys real fighting skills- there should always be at least light contact.
Students should learn how to deal with lines of attack and not preset attacks and counters. Students should learn a ground game like judo or BJJ. Students should learn how deadly serious a knife can be, and not raised on crazy stories of ANYBODY beating 4 to 5 armed attackers- that is the time to run. A 357 magnum may not penetrate a bullet resistant vest, a combat bowie will!!!! Now Millls this is Robert Libby that has been writing, not my student. He is repeating stories I have told him. But they are true.
I have told him to never speak for me again, and he has done this before. If Tom Bleecker says he has no knowledge of me choosing off Ed in his living room he is a liar. He even told people about it who asked me if I chose Ed off.
He dialed the phone for me to Ed’s house. And yes, Lelani begged me not to trash Ed due to his bad heart. And yes, Terry Robinson told Ed he would die if he didn’t change his ways- looked at how Ed died. We were surprised at how long he lived. I checked you out, and you are a nut case. You are a man released from lawsuit due to filing bankruptcy. But the claimant’s claims were upheld and awarded about $39,000.
You live in a whack job state, Utah, and follow a whack job religion, Mormonism. You have all the boxes checked for right-wing crack pot Also, you refer to “fighting” with Mike Stone- non-contact tournament fighting is not fighting- it is high-speed tag. It has no merit for so many reasons. Let me elucidate. My students asked me to fight in the Internationals. I really didn’t want to- this was like 1973.
I was fighting a Norris black belt named Mike Bissel- he was in “Enter the Dragon”, the golf course scene where John Saxon beats up Darnell Garcia, Pat Johnson, and Mike Bissel. He was dating Kim Burbridge, Bob Burbridge;s sister. So who are the corners? Pat Johnson- head referee- Mike Bissel’s teacher. 3 Norris blacks at the corners, and a Tae Kwan Do black belt for the 4th.
I was killing Bissel and couldn’t get a point. His girlfriend was yelling “you’ve got an animal, come on Mike.” So we went into sudden death- as I was driving Mike out of the ring they gave him a point for a bs weak reverse punch, despite my scoring round kick to the body and back knuckle to the face. My students were floored. I had a few choice words for Pat Johnson as I was exiting the area. Steve Sanders once fought Chuck Norris- we had a film of it.
We put it into a hand winder that football teams used to analyze plays. You could move it back and forth and see exactly what happened.
Steve slaughtered Norris- match Norris. I was fighting in the Four Seasons tournament as a green belt. I was headed for the finals. My last match was against a Lima Lama kid named Esquivet.
The last shot was him throwing a spinning rear kick- I blocked it perfectly and hit him with a reverse punch- he got the point. It was awarded by his father.
I believe his name was Saul Esquivel. Steve Sanders had been coaching me at the tournament and was disgusted, Several black belts were actually holding me down as I was going to knock out Saul Esquivel.
Tournament karate had no rules for officiating. It is filled with stories of bad calls and biased officiating. So never bore me with tales of bravado from the tournament world. Both Steve Sanders and Joe Lewis have spoken about what crap tournaments are.
But this is just like you- use a meaningless reference from a crap system with no validity- Mormonism, Kenpo, Ed Parker, tournament karate. Take your pick, they are all BS. No Mills I will not come in and pimp slap the white off of your teeth as you are a pathetic wind bag.
I am 15 years younger and 80lbs heavier You mean nothing to me. My credentials are solid. The best step I ever took was to abandon Kenpo. I do respect a lot of the Kenpo people, although I feel they are misguided in their opinions of Ed and Kenpo. Don’t threaten people.
You can’t back it up and never could. Robert or Ron or Mickey Mouse, who knows who or what you are.
It doesn’t matter, no one cares, because you prove each time you post you don’t tell the truth and have no facts. The only “lawsuit” or litigation involved a construction company in which I was an officer. The suit dragged on for five years; there was no bankruptcy, and no judgement. We won every single issue and the suit was dismissed with prejudice. It is a matter of record. But then FACTS don’t matter to a slanderer.
Yes, Ed Parker grew old. You will too if you are allowed to live. Those of us who knew and trained with Parker in his prime know just how pathetic your attempts to defame him are. I suspect that you wrote all of the previous posts as they contain the same childish drivel.
I’m through with you. You have exposed your ugly soul to all who have read the lies you have spued. The entire martial arts world will know you – congratulations- your fame is well earned.
You will be known as a vicious, petty, lying slander, who will no longer be welcome among people of integrity. Robert Libby-I don’t know you and i don’t know where you live or anything about you. I’m a little shocked by the lack of civility that you display. If you don’t agree with someone it seems you go to great lengths to put down others, including someone who is no longer living.
I’m not sure what art you study, but it can’t be any of the martial arts as these all teach the importance of respect and civility. I wouldn’t be too quick about casting Mills aside.
I’m confident Mills could hold his own with anybody. And even if Kenpo doesn’t work(which I don’t believe)as you state, why the viciousness and attacks? So you all have a difference of opinion-what’s the big deal. Can’t you be happy just doing your thing while others do theirs? Nobody is infringing on that.
I’m also glad that you know how to do a google search! That’s great! From the information you posted about Mills above, I also did some searching. All I can say is you’ve got to get current. Your citing things and events that are 12 years old. Can we do a little better than that?
Interestingly enough, when I tried to find you, you’re nowhere to be found. Which is different than all the people you are attacking in this forum.
Let’s do this. Why don’t you post a workout/sparring tournament that you’ve demonstrated some skill in and let others be the judge of how you do?
What’s good for the goose is good for the gander. By the way-I find you’re “fixes” to the Kenpo system intriguing-starting with the first suggestion. “To block with the back hand instead of the front hand.” Really? You should see how that would work with someone like Tony Martinez, Sr., Paul Mills, Sam Ellis, or Tony Martinez, Jr. They would be over that front hand so fast you wouldn’t have any chance of surviving. But go ahead and try to block with that back hand.
They would make mincemeat out of your frontal features very quickly. Why so nasty anyway? I’m amazed at the lack of respect shown in this thread by what appears to be one person posting as many. Robert/Bob, etc-I don’t know what art you study, but it couldn’t be the martial arts because the legitimate ones I know about all teach humility, respect, and civility.
What’s the big deal anyway? Even if you believe kenpo to be unworthy of study, why can’t folks like Mills do what pleases them and you do likewise? It sounds like you always have to be right. And when something comes along that challenges your point of view, you attack everything about them-the style the study, their religion, their personal life, etc. I do have a suggestion. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander. Since your requesting “proof” that some video is produced showing Ed Parker working out, can we ask the same from you?
Why don’t you produce a video of what your skills look like so that we can all see them and make a comparison. With all your expertise I’m certainly sure you can do that.
You see, while you did a google search on Mills Crenshaw, I did my own research on not only him, but on you. First, some of the things you comment on are 12 years old. Can we get more current than that?
Second, while I can find Mills all over the internet, I cannot find anything about you. Strange with all your knowledge, connections, prowess, etc.
Third, you say your credentials are “solid.” Can you tell us your real name, where you studied, you line of black belt progression, or anything else about you that we can check up on? You see, it’s the year 2014 and it’s much harder to make things up now than it was in the 60’s. Last-I wouldn’t be so quick to cast Mills aside. I’m pretty confident that he could hold his own.
I’m intrigued by some of your “fixes” within the Kenpo system, starting with your first suggestion. “.blocking with your back hand, not the front hand.” I’d love for you to try that one on someone like Paul Mills, Huk Plunas, Tony Martinez, Sr.(or Jr.), or Sam Ellis to name a few. These are the folks I know-of course all of them not worthy of any respect from your point of view, where this would meet with dire consequences. That technique done against Tony Martinez, Sr. Would meet with brutal consequences. He’s be over that lead hand so fast he’d make mincemeat about your facial features.
But you go ahead and be thinking about that back hand block. I’d love to see it. I’ll be looking for your video soon. You see, to me it doesn’t really matter. I do what I enjoy doing, and you enjoy(I think)doing what you do. Why can’t it be laid to rest with that?
Why so nasty Robert/Bob/Ron/Vito, etc.? It does look like you’re trying to drive traffic to this website in the hopes of selling things? I don’t even mind that.
What I do think is in poor taste is the attack on others, particularly one that is no longer living. Maybe we should be worried about you?
Ah hanow I know this is one person who is spewing all of this and then censoring the comments they don’t like to hear. We’ll get the word out what a hoax your website is. There’s other ways to get the word out other than you nixing all comments you don’t like. You dream up these fake conversations and names to stir things up to drive people to your site to sell them something.
I’ve had 2 posts that never made it after being “moderated.” What’s the matter? No video to show us of you and how great you are? It’s no wonder why nobody knows who you are because your a nobody. And someone who says “pimp slap” isn’t 60.
You’re some young punk who wont show up at a dojo when challenged. Solid credentials, huh? Tell us your real name and provide us with highlights of your wonderful martial arts skills to enlighten us. Then let us know who some of your students are. Oh, you don’t have any? You’d last 20 seconds in the ring with anybody decent.
Sorry Snibb I am 62. Sorry for the “lack of humility” but martial art means “war art.” And I get pissed when people lie about me. But I do agree about the “moderator” part.
No, Kenpo does not work. Now think- 1 man against 5 men with knives and clubs- Mils’ comment not mine.
Does that even sound dimly credible to you? Watch Paul Vunak on “Knife philosophy” on Youtube. Knives are very deadly and leave massive damage.
You do not block with the forearm, but rather pass the knife as you zone to stay away from the business end. This type of Hollywood BS does in fact get people killed, and that is my concern. I watched a Kenpo 4th. Degree spend 20 minutes om how the inward block destroys the radial nerve in the forearm, and that a strong punch needs a strong block- COMPLETE CRAP. Watch a boxer block- they merely swipe jabs and crosses away. Inward blocks do not work in real time. Can some Kenpo guys fight” Hell yes- but they never use a Kenpo technique in a real fight.
It breaks down into a sort of full-contact karate. My aim is simple- I do not want people making life changing decisions based on errant information. And virtually all of Ed’s teaching was crap and flawed. Take the “Kenpo challenge- try to do ANy Kenpo technique in real time- GOOD LUCK!!!! Sorry, as a Kenpo practitioner myself, I really would hate for you to miss the chance to see an art that demonstrates the very core of what makes a martial arts technique effective. Before I studied Kenpo, I was an Uechi Ryu Shodan. But I never understood why the art did not work until I studied Kenpo.
You and I both know that Ed Parker had nought but a con. His hoax was not true Kenpo – he stole the name as well. My guess is that he was a colored rank in Kempo – a poor one at that. He made up a system, stole the name from Chu’an Fa Chinese Kenpo and went on to fool the world.
What he did was an absolute disgrace, and there may never be a way to reverse the damage he has caused. Who cares for the, “but-he’s-not-here-to-prove-himself” line.
Anyone in the know can easily spot him as a fake. Let’s just be glad he is not here to continue to disgrace the martial arts. I have been in a few videos, but a long time ago. This is my real name. I ran the Ed Parker Santa Monica school for about 2 years in the 70s.
I also did 90% of the teaching at PFS of Ridgecrest for about 2 1/2 years from 2001 to 2003 ( a Paul Vunak affiliate). So if somebody with Vunak’s credibility and his full instructor thinks I’m fir to teach I guess I know what I’m doing. I have trained in Kenpo, judo, Bjj, kick boxing- American and Muay Thai, boxing, weapons, Kali, Silat, escrima, panantukan and pananjakman. Now I just train a few people overseas and work out. I hike, swim and lift weights also.
So as to credentials- What are Ed’s? Never got a black from Chow, promoted from 1st. By his friends, and then 5th. By the same friends.
One of the effects of time is changing history. In the 60s we always knew Ed stole the book, his second one, from Jimmy Woo, But as always Ed had a story about some student hanging himself due to Jimmy’s errant teaching and a mystical form. Ed always had “stories” for his indiscretions I have no idea as to who Vito is. Ron Morgan is my student. I think I know who Bill Nadal is. I have no idea who Lumberjack Dave is or Monfongo.
I knew of Mills Crenshaw but have never met him. I knew Tom Bleecker from the 60s to the 70s and have not seen him in about 40 years. As to respect- I give it to those that deserve it. Ed deserves little if any. He was critical in promoting martial arts, but his skills are non-existent, his feats the tales of fantasy, and his stabbing loyal people in the back legendary. He was a thief, liar, fraud, charlatan, and fool •.
Dear Snibbs, Now I have an assignment for you also. I can find nothing with Mills Crenshaw on Youtube but his talk show. But I did see a video with ed Parker called Kenpo talk with Ed Parker.
He refers to hinself as a “street fighter from Honolulu.” But he has no arrest record. I have one and so does Larry Hartsell. If you fight you can be arrested. But what so impressed me was HOW BAD ED WAS!!!!!!!! OH MY GOD!!!! He does a multiple man attack and his form is horrible- he looks like an idiot.
And in it he is leaner and his hair is all black so he is about 35? Really look at this crap. It was so horribly set up and Ed’s basics are horrific. So what are you talking about? LOOK AT THE VIDEO! Every video I see Ed in he is either in slow motion or he looks like a weak blue belt. Anybody can look good in slow motion with the opponent cooperating.
But even then he looks uncoordinated, off balance, and weak So this is the “Hawaiian bad ass?” I have never been more convinced as to what a fraud he truly was. I would REALLY like to thank all the Kenpo faithful for getting me o do research and totally realize what a charlatan Ed was. Ok another self masogenst my style is best D. Are you a pro football or hockey athlete? Not many of us are.
So with your reasoning non of us should do it. Or we should only train with super bull or stanley cup coaches. Is it the athlete or the coach. So for your limp mind I suggest sound principles play a key role.
Please understand we all will preceive and apply these differently. In 56 years ive never applied a class room technique. But without thought on several occasions I have when forced used parts and pieces.
And I’m sure I looked off balance but that third person perspective didnt mean crap. Only the resoluts matter. Shut up keep training. To me it doesn’t really matter. I’m a man of no consequence and little in the way of wordly means. Right now I just try to stay healthy and out of hospitals as age and health has caught up with me. I do remember many years ago attending a martial arts clinic where said Mills and Ed Parker were both participating.
I suspect it was recorded by someone but is not up on any youtube videos. I was much younger then(35+ years ago?) I was highly impressed with Ed Parkers skill. His speed, quickness, movements, and power were something to watch.
Maybe I’m easily entertained. As far as him being a street brawler, who knows? He said he was so I believe it.
But even if he wasn’t, it still doesn’t affect me. People make up things all the time and its getting worse today. I find all kinds of things on youtube where Ed is very skilled. I see some things were it’s a demonstration that look a little corny but that’s only because its slowed down to explain some of his interpretations.
I find the same thing in many other forms of karate. By way of arrest records, is that something to brag about? You could have an arrest record and not know one stitch of martial arts. And, by the way, I find no arrest warrant for either you or Larry Hartsell. I do find it strange that the people you say were in the room and knew about all these instances have never really heard of you and/or or they don’t remember the incident as you state.
To me, the tone of this entire attack wasn’t called for. There are many people I don’t care for in this world but I still can have some civility towards them. Maybe not much for some of them, but at least a little. Actually tom Bleecker admits he new me.
The main point is simple- telling people that you can beat 5 knife-wielding attackers is not only stupid, but highly dangerous and irresponsible. I had a student say to me “What would you do if 6 guys with Knives attacked you?” I said “I would die.” He couldn’t believe it. He thought I would win. My goal is always to improve my students- lying and making up idiotic tales of grandeur does not do that. And as I have always said making your students think and believe they can do the impossible can get them killed. As to my being arrested, it was not to brag, but merely to show that I have had a provable fight. My case was dismissed and the accusing parties went to prison for numerous charges- it was in Portland, Oregon.
Larry was arrested in Los Angeles, CA in 1968 or 1969- his case was dismissed as he and his 2 friends did not start the fight. I went as a ride to help bail him out. A person cannot be bailed out by a 16 year-old.
I just ran a Deseret News archive search no such story. That’s a small matter. Your lack of knowledge makes you a danger to anyone who might be tempted to take what you post seriously. First, you misrepresent what others say. It’s an old trick called the “straw man argument.” You restate what other’s write in a ridiculous way; then you tear apart YOUR restatement (attacking the straw man you built) and try to convince the audience that you defeated the original argument. A sophomore debate technique.
Here are the facts: I said Ed Parker considered a “serious fight,” to be four or more armed individuals. Armed with bottles, clubs, tire irons, knives etc. YOU extrapolated that to mean FIVE GUYS WITH KNIVESRIDICULOUS! I had a specific instance in mind.
You were making up hot air to make yourself look good. When Ed Parker was at BYU (1954 -1955) he was driving to Salt Lake from Prove with his wife Leilani. A car load of drunken sailors forced him off the road. They jumped out of their car and came at Ed with a variety of weapons (Bottles, tire iron, club – I don’t remember for certain if there was a knife I think so but Ed isn’t around to clarify). That fight lasted seven seconds. Ed took them as they came at him.
He was worried that he had killed the first attacker who, after he had been struck fell backward and hit his head on the blacktop. But the thing that stood out in your self serving diatribe was this statement: ” You do not block with the forearm, but rather pass the knife as you zone to stay away from the business end.
This type of Hollywood BS does in fact get people killed,” You clearly don’t understand kinfe theory AT ALL. Rule one: When facing a knife assume you’ve already been cut. Rule two: THE ELBOW CONTROLS THE BLADE. Rule three: DON’T BLOCK or GRAB – PARRY the weapon arm and CLOSE with the attacker to CONTROL HIS ELBOW! (For those of you who are serious about the subject, have a friend thrust with a rolled up newspaper as though it were a blade.
Step forward outside the thrust in a neutral bow; your leading hand touches the attacker’s ELBOW, your trailing hand makes a circular parry at the hand or wrist to prevent the blade from cutting you. With a tiny bit of practice you will discover that one you touch the attacker’s elbow you are in control of the blade. By closing with the attacker and controlling his elbow you prevent him from slashing at you. If you “ZONE to stay away from the business end,” as one genius recommends you give the attacker multiple chances to cut you; and cut you he will. A little knowledge is a very dangerous thing.
Ed Parker tells the Utah fight story in his own words. A Karate Illustrated magazine interview, Sept. 16 Somewhat edited for the sake of space.
(but not by much) Magazine (KI): Since you’ve been in the martial arts, have you been involved in any fights? EP: Yes, nine times in my life. Never has my training failed me, and the longest any fight has lasted was nine seconds at the most. My most memorable one was when I was going to college in Utah. My wife, who was pregnant with my first child, was along that night.
Anyway, these four guys just pulled us off to the side of the road and started to get out of their car. They were going to work me over. I dropped two guys within six or seven seconds. I was more frightened that night than in any time of my life. When I hit the first guy, he hit the ground and his head sounded just like a watermelon when it landed. I thought I had taken his life and that’s why I was so scared. It really shook me up, because that guy didn’t move for five minutes.
On that particular night I discovered what mind over matter was. Everything that was happening, was happening in slow motion. It was like I was watching myself while I was fighting.
I mean, while the guy was still punching I was thinking I should crack his ribs, No, that wouldn’t have an effect because if his ribs would break, thenuh, oh, there’s his buddy running in. This is what’s coming to my mind during the action, I’m not kidding. I thought how he’s got a white T shirt on. If I hit him right across the nose and splatter blood all over his shirt, psychologically it will disturb this guy, and worked just like that. His partner came at me and just as he was about to shoot a left, he hesitated when he saw his buddy’s blood gushing. So I blocked his shot and hit him right in the back of the neck. It was funny because he had a cigarette in his mouth and the snap from the hit was so hard it made the cigarette fly.
The other guys jumped in the back of the car and locked themselves in. Later, the guy who was lying unconscious started to twitch and his legs moved. Man was I happy. Then the next month’s issue featured Bill Ryusaki, a Hawaiian Kenpo stylist, and student of Ed Parker. On page 25 of the October 1976 issue of Karate Illustrated magazine, an interview with Ryusaki describes his first meeting with Ed Parker.
He says “I actually saw him really take care of himself. He was literally piling these guys up” So much for the claim that Ed Parker never fought. As to Ed Parker, not a Black Belt under Chow In his book Infinite Insights, Vol 1,(1982) Ed Parker describes his training phase in Utah 1950’s,(pg.25-27), drafted for the Korean War, joins the Coast Guard for Hawaii (1951-54), and completes his training with William Chow, during his Coast Guard days, then returns to BYU, in late 1954. Indeed, the photo on top of pg. 26, captioned, “Ed Parker as a Black Belt with William Chow”. Ed Parker gives Chow the utmost respect.
“I treasured the time I spent with him and the revelations I obtained from our conversations and workouts. As I look back, I cannot thank him enough for setting me on a path of logical and realistic thinking.” (pg. 1) Ed Parker tried to convince Chow to move to the mainland, but as told on page 28, in 1959, Chow rejected the idea of moving to California, and gave Parker his ‘blessing’ to carry on without him. Why would Chow give Parker his blessing if Parker was still a brown belt? In fact, Ed Parker went to college precisely to bolster his own credentials with the public to gain trust and credibility as a teacher.
Why would he not seek a basic instructor level credential as a Black Belt in the very field he was good? Since I seem to have a hard time getting anything approved on this site, I’ll keep things a little more generic.
Robert-I’m with Snibb on this one. I’d like to see you in action with some techniques that show how you might do things. Any tournament clips?
Self-defense techniques? How about a studio name that we can all see to verify what you’re saying? If you’ve got something better than Kenpo, why not all of us see it? I’d be interested in that. I’m not sure what an arrest record attests to. All that tells me is that you’ve had problems with the law-a bad thing.
I know a few guys who have arrest records and they don’t know the first thing about martial arts. They might not even know how to fight. Having an arrest record doesn’t tell me anything about how good you are at whatever style you study or even if you know any martial art. All I can add is this: I do know Mills-I’ve trained with him locally, are recently. I think it would be a huge mistake to think that he couldn’t defend himself, or that the techniques he knows and teaches wouldn’t be fight-worthy on the street.
He can generate an awful lot of speed, momentum, and power. I wouldn’t want to be on the opposite end of anything he throws. The same can be said for my instructor Tony Martinez, Sr. I think Tony is now 74.
If Kenpo doesn’t work you should have seen what Tony did last night to a very talented hapkido martial artist who is 20+ years his younger. Mills= this is getting tiring, but I will post a video soon. As to the Deseret news, when you put “Mills Crenshaw” on Google you get three choices- Talk show, Kenpo, and lawsuit. You click on lawsuit and the Deseret article comes right up. It is about a pension fund and blatantly says that you were dismissed from the suit as you filed bankruptcy A golden rule of propaganda, lying, is make it a big lie.
This is the basis of all religions. Brigham Young said that there are people living on the moon, they are of uniform size, dress like Quakers, and have been seen with telescopes. He also stated that people live on the sun. He also stated that he has never been wrong not given false council- no ego there. The point here is make up a big lie and people believe it more readily. You refer to people that “trained” with Ed- he never trained. When I was at the Santa Monica school he always would set up classes, and then cancel them.
He once said he was going to have a Saturday black belt class taught by him to standardize all the techniques and forms- that lasted about 1 day as he cancelled it the next day. Benny Urquidez, whose credentials are impeccable, was teaching at Santa Monica on Friday nights. He finally left as Ed kept cancelling training appointments. He promised Benny that he would teach him the entire Kenpo system. Benny’s comment- “He never showed me a damn thing.” Ed was notorious for being lazy, cancelling appointments, and making false promises.
So here we have Benny leaving due to Ed’s lack of commitment, and Larry Hartsell, also a man of incredible talent, that called Ed a “Kenpo clown.” But as I previously stated, look at the videos- he is HORRIBLE. And the entire “Honolulu street fighter” myth was started by Ed. When I produce a video clip I will show how Ed knew nothing about fighting, basic principles of body mechanics, and how to make some of the techniques work. Funny how the Senior Grand Master knew so little. I will also show how many Kenpo techniques put you in a worse position than you started in by showing timing errors, bad mechanics, and just plain stupidity. Yes, Kenpo works great if the opponent stands there and lets you beat him up.
But in real life people do not do that. I guess that’s why he never received a black belt, was promoted to 5th.
Degree by his cronies, and then to 10th. I hold Robert Libby beneath contempt, not for anything he has done, for I don’t know the man; but for the slander he has perpetrated against a GOOD and HONORABLE man, who was my instructor, my friend and my brother— Ed Parker. In pursuit of the truth, I researched Libby’s claim that there was a story linking me to a lawsuit in the Deseret News. I had never seen the story so when the slanderous claim was made I denied its existence. There was such a story. However, like everything else that Libby spouts that brief, thirteen year old story was false, misleading and inaccurate.
I Know Curtis DeYoung, casually; but I have NEVER AT ANY TIME been part of, or associated with his company, American Pension Services, I have never been part of, associated with or taken so much as a penny from Orion Communications, Inc. The company named in the alleged lawsuit. That part of the thirteen year old “story” was totally in error. Nevertheless, Mr. Libby was correct, only to the extent that there was such an article. People like Mr.
Libby identify themselves for all to see each time they open their mouths or write for public consumption. Strong’s Open Concordance says it best: STRONG’S CONCORDANCE: diabolos: slanderous, accusing falsely Original Word:????????,?? Part of Speech: Adjective Transliteration: diabolos Phonetic Spelling: (dee-ab’-ol-os) Short Definition: slanderous, the Slanderer, the Devil His attack on me is fine, I’m still here to defend myself and set the record straight; but his attack on Ed Parker is cowardly, slimy, churlish and beneath contempt. He then magnifies his calumny by slandering “all religion.” In his ignorance he quotes fully discredited “anti-church” authors who made up straw man stories and then tore those stories down in an attempt to defame men of faith. So be it; Libby raised the specter of religion, that will be the test: •Matthew 7:20 20: Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
The fruits of Ed Parker’s Genius have spread throughout the world. Hundreds of thousands of high ranking Black Belts owe their skills to instructors, teaching on many of the continents of the globe, who got their training either from Ed Parker or one of his first or second generation instructors. Some have branched out into schools and systems of their own; but most, with the exception of the egocentric, pay respectful tribute, to the man who paved the way.
WHAT GLORIOUS WONDERS HAVE YOU PRODUCED MR LIBBY? Ed Parker didn’t have to brag about his achievements; they exist in the real world. Others sing his praises. But from YOU, MR LIBBY, all I hear is a chorus of off key slander. SHOW US YOUR FRUITS so we may judge your worth.
Mills, you are such a bore and journalistic hack. You think because you spew a little Shakespeare you are an intellectual giant. But as you, I believe were on his board to promote him from 1st. To 5th., and then 5th. To 10th., you have things to gain from deception and lose from the truth. It is so simple- you said The Deseret News had no such story- I can get it it 1 second. The other thing anybody can get is how bad Ed really was on Youtube.
Go to Youtube and watch “Ed PArked Late LAte Show”, “Ed Parker, Mills Crenshaw, Jeff Speakman”, and Ed Parker Kenpo concepts in motion. He looks slow, uncoordinated, and foolish. Watch the 10 man wipe out and look at his kicking, and how some shill falls over from a kick a yellow belt would be ashamed of. Also watch Ed Parker Huk Planas and look at how ridiculous they look.
The techniques I will be critiquing will be 5 swords (the 5 count), twin kimono, triggered salute, the “back breaker”, and one other for a rear shoulder grab. I will effectively show why the training method is so flawed, why these show that Ed knew nothing, and how to make some of them work. The holes in Kenpo are not pin holes, but rather chasms of stupidity and fraud- just like Ed’s supposed skills and street fights. I have a life outside of the Internet. I am currently very busy with my 18 year-old getting ready to go to university. As to slamming Ed Parker take a number.
I am hardly alone in this. To give you a quick idea as to how to better your skills do not block like they do in Kenpo.
If you are in a matched use the back hand to block the attackers front hand and the front hand to block the back hand- the opposite of Kenpo and most Karate systems. Never train off of a step through reverse punch. Always throw counters when the techniques are done, and never use a Kenpo knife defense technique. I have part of the video done, but not all of it. I want to really show how little Ed Parker knew, and be very precise as to why the techniques cannot be used in real time.
I want to also show how techniques like twin kimono put you in jeopardy due to how stupid they are (it leaves you wide open for a head butt to the face). T o answer Mills, the “drunken sailor” story has so far happened in 4 states. There is also the time he and Chuck Norris took on 5 guys in the San Fernando Valley (a part of Los Angeles) and Ed took out 4 while Chuck struggled to take out 1- also bullshit. More straw man arguments based on fictitious stories, from a man who never met Ed Parker. The incident with the sailors happened on the highway between Provo and Salt lake City. I know both Chuck and Ed Parker and I have never heard that account from either man.
Your understanding of what Parker taught is as fictitious as your straw man stories. Some of the techniques, taught in his name, have strayed from what he taught. But your description is laughable. Nearly as laughable as your childish attempts to attack the Scriptures. I no longer read your infantile Blog; but only respond to the email notifications.
I suggest the handfull of readers who remain do the same •. I studied from one of James Wing Woo’s students in Berkeley, CA and at 14 my dad sent me to Hollywood to study from James Wing Woo. My short time with him influenced my life, he is a great teacher! His workouts were on stone floors waxed to a slippery finish then he added dancers wax or something like that. We wore rope sole shoes and did high spin kicks and a lot of horse stances, you had to have excellent balance and your legs turned to steel. I am over 50 and still squat in the mid 400-500 lb range.I attribute this to my horse stance training in his system.
I went to Hollywood again recently but could not find his studio. I think you need to talk to Olohe Solomon Kaihewalu. I believe the Parker’s path is through the family of William Kwai Sun Chow who happened to be married into the family. He was by marraige introduced to Kapu Kuia Lua. Now known as Lua.
I believe Lua was not taught to Houlies before this time. It was also forbidden to teach anyone not of Hawaiian descent the art of the King. Kamameha to be precise. So, it is not as if Parker had no experience. He had been introduced to Lua, Kempo Kosho,Sil Lum Pai, and Danzan Ryu by the schools which happened to be at the same location in the Province. From these schools come the Kajukenbo, Danzan Ryu Jiu Jitsu, Lua, Lima Lama and schools from Chinese Gung Fu such as Sil Lum Pai.
Represented by contemporaries of Shihan Edward “Bobby” Lowe, Bill Ryusaki, Tino Tuiolosega, and Olohe Solomon Kaihewalu. Being that Parker was a Polynesian Bradda, not only in the arts but as a descendant of Hawaii himself.
A young lad in Hawaii as a Hawaiian it would be remiss to believe he was not exposed to these things, these schools prior to opening his first Dojo. If you look and piece together the movements alone. You will see all the influences you would have in the Hawaiian Islands at the time. You would see the structure of Okinawa Kempo, The influence of Jiu Jitsu from Parker’s Judo days.
The influence of Kali from Emperado, the Bone Breaking of Kaihewalu Lua and Polynesian Lima Lama among others from this place and time. These are the influences, these men the “Old School” Family Members not in name but by blood that were their Families arts. Pieced together by Parker to become “American” Kenpo. Identifying them as Chinese, if and maybe only to call attention to the roots and it’s ancient attachments. My only words of dismay were the fact that Parker did not give enough credit to his own Hawaiian forms of the arts of Kapu Lua and Flowering Hands of Wisdom of Tino Tuilosega and Solomon Kaihewalu.
Who for him to identify the arts before his death would have been forbidden. The reason for so many followers of the arts are “Do they work?” I think the times the older arts were used by many in places like Tarawa, and Sai Pan by many of the original teachers of the original systems used to defend this country. So why would anyone try to defame the man who actually brought the original mass influence of Asian arts to the American Mainland, including introduction of Jun Fan (Bruce Lee) to the world. When in reality, they should be thanking him. It is also a demeaning of those who shared their works not only with him but with others prior to him even coming to the mainland. So, I don’t believe in speaking ill of others. The reality is to take it and if it is good use it.
If not, discard it. That was well said and I can understand as I studied Oh Do Kwan in it’s most purist form before General Choi added the sine wave. He can from a Chung Do Kwan school; the first one I believe and created the Chong Hon Tuls based of Karate, Taekyon, and the Chung Do Kwan he’d learned from his instructors. With Kenpo there is a lot of infighting just like Taekwondo and at best it is rather strange that they are still fighting as someone wishes to lay claim to who did what, when, where, and how. For m, I never bought into the whole ITF hype and I practices some Kenpo from a student of Skip Hancock in Alaska, Kenpo 2000, I believe it is,yes I am looking at a book even as I type.
I applied some of the techniques to my Oh Do Kwan and it works just fine. Again I find it very interesting that they are still fighting over all of this. What a swell history lesson- but proves nothing about fighting. Yes, Rd Introduced Bruce and was instrumental in starting his career. But what dies that have to do with real fighting? I agree Ed got very popular, and loathed at the same time.
I worked for him for 2 years. He had so many bad traits- lazy, inconsiderate, egotistical, thief, and liar. So why should I respect him? Who do I respect in martial ars? Paul Vunak, Tom Cruse, Dan Inosanto, Benny Urquidez, all MMA fighters, the Gracies, Hayward Nishioka, Gene LeBell, Bruce Lee, etc These were fighters and innovators. The proof is all over Youtube.
Look at videos of Ed in his prime and examine how bad he was- pathetic is a better word. Anybody who is that uncoordinated, lacking in power, form and focus, and gases out in under a minute is not a martial artist. Kenpo people can brag about Parker all they want- the proof is in the videos. It is very easy to attack a dead man.
It is much more difficult to explain History to those who refuse to listen. I am not a “Parker acolyte” I do know the History by talking to the people who were there. I read, then investigate and ask the people who were there.
Like Chow’s family. It is easier to deride someone you don’t know, especially when he is dead.
It is much more difficult to prove those things. I didn’t know Parker himself, I have seen his work.
His ideals are in use today and yes even in MMA. Don’t mistake laziness for a low kick, or trap. Remember MMA as an ideal started with the people in Palama. Karate, Judo, Kempo, Boxing = KAJUKENBO 1925 – 1981. It was also influenced by Sil Lum Pai of China, and Harimau of the Filipinos.
And Lua from Hawaii. Where balance meant everything.
I find it interesting you name Labelle, Nishioka a student of Nobuo Nishamori a friend of mine. Benny Urquidez a student of Bill Ryusaki.
As “real warriors” when it is Chinese Kenpo that Ryusaki gave to Urquidez. Yet you leave out men like Tino Tuilosega who fought in WWII using Lima Lama, real battle not for Glory and Fame, but Life and Death, with knives, guns, clubs in the sands of Tarawa against trained foe. For him and his country. “You see it is not who is right, but who is left.” •.
You are still dancing around the issue. If you test the reflexes of a person you would be amazed at how close they are in a basic test. I once saw them check the reflexes for Jeremy Clarkson of Top Gear against Michael Schumacher- very close. The point to this is analysis, not a history lesson.
But to straighten out one fact I chose Ed off when he was alive- he would not fight me, so so much for the “when they are dead BS.” The basic techniques used by the EPAK crew are physically impossible to do in real time. When somebody is standing there like a pole it is easy to look great.
For example, when people do the “back breaker” the “dummy” lays on your knee and folds his arms over his chest while you pound on him- gee, that will happen in a real fight!!! When they do “Clutching Feathers” they gingerly lay there hand on the dummy’s head to simulate a hair grab- that is not how a hair grab is done in a fight. And when you step back to “trap” the hand on the head that is the dumbest thing you could do- you will get punched in the face. I know Tino and have moved with him. His strength was his boxing, guile and size- too bad the smoking killed him.
And Kenpo is used in MMA? Are you nuts? One guy sent me all these video clips saying it was Kenpo they were using- pure BS. Chuck Liddel comes from a Kenpo system- when has he ever used it in MMA? Also, not only did I know Ed, I worked for him for 2 years after training at his school for 6 years. I new Bill Ryusaki (famous for the first personal injury lawsuit as his student used what Bill taught him and hurt a kid at his high school).
And when did Benny ever use a Kenpo technique in the ring, or in a fight? He used boxing with kicking. Put Bobby Lowe into Google and look at videos of a man with the last name Greco doing full contact- he was quite good, but it was boxing with kicking. No one has ever seen a Kenpo technique used in real time as it cannot be done.
So I know and have moved with virtually everybody in your history lesson. I guess that is first hand experience as opposed to from a book. I did a demo with Ed, Tino, and some big friend of Tino’s that had a glass eye- this was for the Screen Actor’s Guild in like 1967. So when did you move with any of these people? And I was respected enough as a 15 year old kid to be asked to do a demo for important people. Granted I was just a punching bag for Tino, but Ed said “I know you can take a shot.” And Tino really smacked me a couple of times. So once again, who of these people have you actually trained with or done anything with?
And as to lazy- Ed truly set the mark. Always cancelling appointments, never training, always late with belt certificates, never training, etc Ask Nishamori about Bill Asimow- he trained me when I was a kid. He was my father’s CPA and got me started. He was I believe a 7th degree in judo, but lymphatic cancer ate him up at a fairly early age (I think he was like 60), a real tragedy. So all the people you name I know and have worked with, I chose Ed off when he was alive and he refused, and he went off on me over the lies a green belt and threatened to, as he stated it, “beat up Bob’s beginning students.” What a tough guy!!! And these are all facts. He never told the owner of the health club that he would beat me up, but rather “beginning students.
And Tom Bleecker, who said he had no knowledge of me choosing Ed off asked me how I was going to fight Ed. So you believe who you want.
As to the video It is in process. I reviewed it and felt a lot of the angles were a little tricky to see and there were close ups that were too close and longer shits that were too long. But I will show the fallacies of Kenpo and Ed’s complete lack of knowledge. What I equate this to is the “Wizard of Oz.” Everybody is so afraid to look behind the curtain. And like all cult leaders there is money to made or lost. Many people that praise Ed use his system and rake in the cash. Or they refuse to really analyze what he taught.
Also two more facts- NOBODY denies that Ed was promoted to 5th. By his students. So would somebody of such a shoddy and despicable charade perhaps be involved in other questionable practices? And Ed dropped dead of a massive heart attack in the Honolulu airport at 59 years of age- fairly young by today’s standards. So please tell me where I am wrong? Can’t Nishimori is dead. Like Bobby Lowe is also dead.
Of which you would or should have known. But it might serve one better to seek to unify peace than to foment strife, is that not why one spends all the time training? For me, if I held animosity I would have to say I have missed the target of what all the training was really for. I don’t care really where when or how. The reality is I have seen and used many of the techniques in real life like fist of jade, spear of jade, leap of death. They have worked, not in the ring where everyone is bound by those rules. But in the street.
But reality is Kyokushin was founded on 18 hands Lohan Kenpo, that was Oyama’s original form. Many of the techniques are similar.
History is important because if you know from where you come, you are less likely to get lost along the path you travel. “The reason we train in the martial arts is to build a strong spirit. Karate means “Empty hands” but that is not one word. Empty means your mind. No anger, No hate,No Ego” Hand is Peace, with No Fist.” -Soke Takayoshi Nagamine Saying this You seem to be angry?
I figured they were dead. But you never know. Woo is still teaching and he is like 90.
Another reason we train is to learn reality and to analyze. We also need to speak out when we see blatant stupidity that can get people hurt. We also need to improve concepts and techniques to make them more realistic. We also need to expose fraudulent ideas and practitioners. I feel that almost any martial art is great as a form of exercise and for health. But when I see ideas that are so ridiculous that they get people hurt I will speak out. And just as I speak out against religious cults as they are dangerous I will speak out against false martial arts concepts.
And the whole idea of “they don’t use it MMA because because it is too deadly” is a crock of crap. No more history lessons. I know all about Oyama and Lowe. Instead why don’t you do an analysis of why this works.
The reason is it doesn’t work. 90% of all martial arts do not work. The grappling arts are the most effective and always have been. On closing go to “Joe Rogan with Bas Ruten” on fake martial arts.
A really great analysis on the supposed efficacy of most karate and kung fu systems. I study under someone who is part of the Parker lineage. For fear of being admonished, I’ll stay quiet on who exactly I’m under.
If it helps, my instructor is friends with Frank Trejo and Mr. Trejo visited our location several years ago. I’m not a linguistics expert, but I’m quite well versed in writing, and as a Kenpo practitioner, observation. I’ve read through the rantings of Ron Morgan, Robert Libby, vito and survy. In my opinion, these people are all the same author posting under different aliases. All the posts tend to misspell similar words and follow consistent grammatical formatting.
The tone of the writing is almost identical. The judicious use of CAPITAL LETTERS is consistent throughout these posts. Exclamation points are very similar too.
Whenever one of these posters is super jacked up, I usually see 6 exclamations points. Normally jacked up gets 4 exclamation points.
Sort of jacked is 1 or 2. Almost every time. The smoking gun, however, is the simple hyphen, or dash.
You see Ron Morgan/Robert Libby/Vito/Survy – you consistently use the same hyphen/dash format in your posts. It always follows this pattern: “word”- “next word”. So for everyone reading, have a look. Word – Dash – Space – Next Word. Ron/Robert/Vito/Survy is, in my opinion, one in the same person. As for Mills, we’ve not met, but I believe you are authentic.
My instructor is in his 60’s and gives up probably 60 or 70 lbs to me. I am in my early 40’s, and just about ready to test for 3rd brown. He’d clean my clock.
Writing is a window into one’s soul. You’re right. I know nothing. And I don’t need to be right because it doesn’t matter to me as I have no skin in the game.
I’m waiting for the further light and knowledge that you promised to send. I was going to ask you if you have more than 1 or 2 good friends? Make that any friends. I’d be surprised if you had even one. And if you do is he as miserable as you are? Like a previous poster asked: Where’s the video clowny? Lots of talk but a no-show from what appears to be a big-talker.
Lets see some video. Simple as that. Gee Snibbs, how easily you get rattled.
For one who doesn’t care you sure seem concerned. To make a good video takes about 3 hours per technique, so 15 to 16 hours. I do not so things in a half assed fashion. Their is the Kenpo technique, why it is wrong, explaining realistic fighting concepts, and then the improved version.
To do an 18 minute American sitcom takes 1 week for 18 minutes – do the math. So let’s throw it back at you- where is one decent Ed Parker video? Nobody can produce one of those.
I can lead you to many bad ones. In America, where I no longer live 1/5 adults is illiterate, 20% of high school seniors are illiterate, 37% cannot find America on a map. People like you- the wafflers who have no commitment to anything. You flip-flop like a pancake. And I am quite happy with plenty of friends.
A criminal record Uncontrolled temper Uncontrolled language Bitter, angry old man Yeah, you sound like you must be a real winner with lots of friends. I only wish I could have seen Ed in his prime and you in yours. I feel confident that you’d be on the mat in less than 30 seconds. Attacking a deceased individual and then anybody else who happens to come in your way.
Big, bravo, and macho. You’ve been promising all of us your knowledge filled videos. Fifteen to 16 hours to film 3 techniques? I guess you’re not as bright as you think you are.
You can do it in about 2 minutes and everyone knows that. There’s these things called iPads-I’ll tell you a little bit about them sometime. Oh, that’s right. You don’t have one because you can’t buy one because you’re unemployable. Enough of the bragging. Let’s see the proof tough guy.
We’re all sitting on pins and needles in anticipation of that knowledge you promised to send. Why did you leave the U.S.? I didn’t think so. And don’t bother with the different aliases that you go by-Ron, Liddy, survy, etc. You were busted by an earlier poster.
Now go and spew some more of that anger that’s visible for everyone to see. There you go, I knew you wouldn’t let us down. Now go have some dinner by yourself because you have no friends, family, or life.
Truth is what it is. If I hold the truth and present it to you and you do not accept it, I do not get angry. I just move on. If the truth is presented and your base, (much like in the arts) is weak you are easily uprooted and become frustrated, and angry. You are not very well rooted in either your beliefs nor in your argument. Reality is Benny Urquidez is and was a practitioner of Hawaiian Chinese Kenpo under Bill Ryusaki.
Chuck Liddel who was trained in the Hawaiian System under Hackelman and Jiu Jitsu with John Lewis and others. To say they never used Kenpo Techniques in MMA is funny, since MMA came originally from Kajukenbo. Kajukenbo was derived from Hawaiian Chinese Kenpo, I think they even say “We were the first Mixed Martial Art.” Chinese Kenpo is a combination of Lua, Malama, Kempo Okinawa, Jiu Jitsu. So they do not use one technique. They use many techniques from the system. Kajukenbo’s main man was Emperado (Kali) who was a training partner of Bill Ryusaki,Ralph Castro who all trained under William Chow. Chow taught Parker.
Chow combined Okazaki Sensei’s Dan Zan Ryu with Mitose’s Kenpo. Chow was introduced to Lima Lama, Lua by Samoan Tino Tuiolosega and Hawaiian Solomon Kaihewalu.
These became the foundation of AMERICAN HAWAIIAN CHINESE KENPO. Keep it going.funpersonally I have no pony in this. I met Mr Parker once at a seminar.
He seemed impressive to me and I was glad I wasnt a dummie of his because he beat the hell out of those guys lol. I studied Tracy’s for a couple of years with Mr. Mitchell first who I can attest to being able to handle his self and several others in that class that could. Mitchell then wen to study with Parker. IMHO Kenpo techniques teach quick reaction to in the face situations. When fighting with a referee starting across the ring it would be hard to pull off but that’s not what they were designed to do just teach quick responses in close. Most systems if practiced live with adjustments can be devastating.
I many years ago did a non contact style of TKD which often gets shit for good reason. However several of us who had studied Judo, adapted sparring to full contact with throws, and Ne Waza.
I also got to the point of breaking concrete with a knuckle punch from about 8″ to replicate a quick strike that could disable anyone. After about two years we couldn’t find anyone to play with except some Kykoshin fighters, a style which I love btw. I was talking with Rorian Gracie in 89 and thought that Bjj was Ne Waza on roids, showed the first gracie in action tape to my father a judo instructor and it added greatly to our play. My son currently is a bjj purple belt submission machine and if my body wasn’t so messed up at 58 I would do it for the love of it.
Finally beware of challangeing old men lol. You might get me, or many much tougher, say Google Jim Harrison for one. But please continue I love history and the back and forth even if it gets a little disrespectful. Almost every art of Jiu Jitsu,Kenpo, Yawara in Japan are descendants of Tenshin Katori Shinto Ryu. Which is basically Kenpo Jiu Jitsu. Judo, was brought to the United States by Maeda Sensei, a student of Jigoro Cano.
Who was asked by Theodore Roosevelt to teach his techniques of Jiu Jistu. Maeda was pinned by a 300 lb Offensive Guard from the United States Naval Academy. He was so embarrassed by the incident he left the country and moved to Brazil. He was met at the boat by one of the Gracie’s who introduced him to Helio. Maeda had no money or place to stay so in exchange he taught Cano Judo to the Gracies in exchange. At this time Judo focused on the joint manipulation and different Waza. He taught these to the Gracies.
Thus Gracie or Brazilian Jiu Jitsu was born. While Kano began focusing on the throws and this became the focus of Japanese Ju Jitsu or Judo. Okazaki Sensei began teaching forms of Jiu Jitsu in Hawaii. He learned Kapu Lua from Hawaiians like Kaihewalu, Kali from bands of Philipinos, and Chinese Kung Fu Sil Lum Pai from Wo Chung. Mitose was teaching a form of Kenpo/ Kempo and Chow and Bobby Lowe Arther Keawe among others were cross training in Sil Lum Pai, Flowering Hand (Lua) of Hawaii. These FIRST MIXED MARTIAL ARTISTS in America.
Bobby Lowe went on to be the highest ranking Kyokushin Shihan in the World, and the first Kyokushin Dojo outside of Japan. Chow taught many others including Bill Ryusaki who was Benny Urquidez’s instructor. Yes then there was Ed K. Parker, friend of Elvis and founder of the first International Asian Martial Arts Tournament. Where Jun Fan otherwise known by his friends as Bruce Lee.
Was introduced to the World. As for Parker’s fighting abilities, as I get older as many do the body does not function the same. Especially if you have heart issues.
Tired lethargy are part of it, shortness of breath another. So to judge based upon that is assuming a lot. Parker died of a Heart Attack at a fairly young age.
So maybe just maybe, just maybe he was focusing on the mental aspects and depending on his younger acolytes to produce the movements. But what can not be taken away was the profound effect he had on Martial Arts in the Western world. So, truth is, WHAT IS ALL THE FIGHTING ABOUT?
We have all gained benefit from Parker in some way. Steve, You are absolutely correct. Over the last sixty years, from time to time, I would hear fictional stories from blowhards claiming to have backed Ed down or they “knew someone” who had done so. My answer was always the same: “Really? When was their funeral? They’re not dead?
What hospital are they in? Not hospitalized? Then it didn’t happen.” It’s very much like the idiots who demonstrate their ignorance of the mechanics of the martial arts by saying, “Oh Kenpo’s no good, those guys are always slapping themselves.” They condemn themselves as second class fighters because they have never learned the concepts that Ed Parker developed involving speed patterns, anchoring secondary blocks and the fact that bouncing off your own body can double the speed of a block or strike. They are also ignorant of the fact STOPPING a pattern of motion, block or strike, consumes both time and energy not lost when the pattern is redirected by bouncing off one’s own body. That’s alright.
Let them continue in their ignorance. Feel sorry for them. They were not trained by a true master of the art. Cordially, Mills •.
Sorry, but you are a fool. Steve, Ed probably never got more than a brown. FACT-Mills was on the “committee” that promoted Ed from 1st.
Black to 5th. Black FACT- Ed was.again promoted from 5th. By his same cronies FACT- Ed never competed FACT- Ed virtually never taught FACT- Ed was told he would drop dead by fitness trainer Terry Robinson in the 70s as he was in such deplorable physical condition FACT- Ed dropped dead from a massive heart attack due to his NEVER training and horrible health habits FACT- Ed was chosen off by at least 2 people and would not fighr Ed spread the stories of all his “legendary” street fights. All the above are FACTS and provable. Hey Mills- deny that you promoted Ed with all your cronies!!! And you all could reap economic benefits from this charade.
Robert, Whoa man take a breath. No dispute on your facts all true. Although I’ve been studying Kenpo for 30 years (I’m 55) I’ve never had the opportunity to meet Mr Parker.
However I’ve trained and studied with many of his first generation students and others as I took advantage of the available seminars in my areas when ever possible. You see, yes he was a brown belt under Chow. Parker had all the Kenpo he needed from Chow.
His art as it currently stands is so much more than the rudimentary movements Chow taught. As for his rank, well, who else would you want promoting him? A committee of peers makes sense and is the norm in many organizations absent a central leader.
Ed Parker was the master of Ed Parker Kenpo. Ed Parker was a big Hawiaan who loved to eat. Had he gone and had a physical perhaps a bypass would have saved his life. We are all responsible for our own health.
As for Ed Parker competing, I can’t say. He was a teacher and there were plenty of his students who did compete: Tom Kelly, Lee Wedlake, Frank Trejo, Manny Rejes, and many more all over the country have competed under the Ed Parker banner. Recall the Internationals?
As a guy who is fond of facts, look out at the Kenpo landscape across the country and the many different off shoot systems that trace their origins back to Ed Parker. People like the Tracy’s and Nic Cerio Kenpo. Jeff Speakman, Skip Hancock, Sean Kelley in Florida, Bob White, Paul Dye, Joe Palanzo, Dennis Nackard (these are the instructors I can name) all practice a version and as closely aligned with Ed Parker as they can make it and as they understood it. If they want to add to EPAK they’re free to do so.
All these people have trained countless more students who in turn may have started their own studios and the flame is carried on. All because of Ed Parker. We are all flawed, even Ed Parker as you have succinctly pointed out, but Ed Parker was also a truly great man and a martial artist who’s legacy continues on. Have a safe and enjoyable holiday week. Steve Shaffer •.
I’ll answer this easily- Parker virtually never taught and at his seminars all he did was talk. If you want a real seminar go to one of Paul Vunak’s or Libre Fighting. They will run you into the ground. The Internationals are a non-contact event and meaningless- the officiating was often horrible and mant times rings were stacked with one competitors school. Read Joe Lewis opinions about non-contact tournaments- I helped run the Internationals several times.
As to his promotions- he could have gone back, apologized, and been promoted. But you forget a key factor- Parker was LAZY! And he was also dishonest. He constantly made promises he never kept, late with promotion certificates, made commitments to his instructors and then broke them, lied about people (Paul Dalton in particular), and neither trained nor taught. Do not use Palanzo as a reference- he is a clown. I watched his videos and he is a complete zero.
Like fake religions people became brainwashed. My goal is simple- I don’t want somebody getting a real life situation and getting hurt or killed because he put his faith in bullshit. And Kenpo knife techniques are REALLY dangerous. Paul Vunak talks about irresponsible teaching in regard to the knife- he is right.
Also watch the Joe Rogan show with Bas Ruten. They are talking about “fake martial arts.” They discuss how many MA people say “I could poke you in the eyes.” Ruten’s comment to them is “OK, and I am better at that than you are.” And when you ground fight you learn about protecting your eyes. Now as to “more than rudimentary movements”- THEY ARE ALL WRONG!!!!!!!! The blocking is backwards, the “minor hits” are ridiculous, and many techniques put you in a worse position that you started- Clutching Feathers, wide open to be punched in the face, Twin Kimono wide open to be head butted in the face, Lone Kimono, wide open to be punched or kicked, Five Swords you are open for a back hand cross on the block and open for a hook on the heel palm, etc You sound like a nice reasonable guy. But I have been doing this all my life- I don’t want people hurt by stupidity.
So do something that I suggest to many- go in the ring- you will get clobbered. Resist the techniques and do not cooperate- the techniques fall apart instantly. For example, have somebody do Twin Kimono on you- just do not straighten your arms- they become baffled. You play like you practice. As in Clutching Feathers the aggressor GENTLY lays his hand on the person’s scalp and stands there while you pound him.
Look at a hockey fight- grab the jersey hit the face. In the street- GRAB THE HAIR HARD, PUNCH TO HEAD. So why in the name of God would you step back and PERFECTLY frame your face with one hand on the head and one to the armpit? Can you not see how vulnerable that leaves you?
In closing, I was training some Kenpo guys. They were green to brown belt level.
I started resisting the techniques, and they were flabbergasted. They did not IMMEDIATELY go to a new technique as they say you will- they froze.
At that time Kenpo had the 128 technique system. We went through all 128- most left Kenpo as they determined, by actual resistance and my insights, that of the 128 MAYBE 10 could work on their own, and some by the changes I showed them So a max of 20 out of 128. That’s a piss poor showing.
You have a nice holiday too. Mine will be great as our 19 year-old is coming home from university for Xmas to New Year’s DAy. Quite the discussion. Allow me to break down some of the information you dispute.
Let’s say on Twin Kimono you don’t extend your arms. You immediately switch to hooking wings modified with a knee to the groin as opposed to a kick due to range. The raking hammer fist then is converted to an elbow.
If you know the techs you should see that this adaptation will work. As for your argument of clutching feathers leaving yourself open for a punch in the face, possibly if you had been trained incorrectly. Your pinning hand is acting in dual purpose. It’s meant to be used as a close cover while pinning. The thought behind the tech is to pull your attacker off balance while you strike the nerve in the armpit. You are correct when you say the techs won’t work. But that is not what they are about.
These are puzzle pieces. If you truly understand the system then you realize that adaptation is the key to using the movements not merely trying to accomplish 5 swords by the numbers. By submitting a green through brown belt to an attack that isn’t ideal is like pushing a 3 year old down and telling him that learning to walk is ineffective. Most of the information in the system is still being ingrained and usually the idea of having to switch techs in mid stream doesn’t come along till black belt is achieved. The fighting principles are sound learning to adapt is a level of training 90 percent of martial artist unfortunately never reach. The adaptation was Parker’s goal for his students. Remember he said he wanted to teach you to be a mechanic of motion so that one day you would become an engineer of motion.
Which if you have ever been in a street fight you would know that is the only way to win,As for the history of Mr. Parker I can only say I have read and heard many stories but I can neither confirm nor deny these stories.
It is not of my concern it neither helps nor hinders how I train. Remember Bruce Lee? Great physical shape, died younger than Parker. And where is Lee’s sparing videos? But that doesn’t seem to bother you? I only know people of good character that trained with Mr.
Parker that stand up for his character. For me that will have to do. As for your tech video I would actually love to see it, I am regularly examining the techs to see where the weakness is to make myself a better martial artist. This keeps me out of the ideal phase since I know for a fact that a fight never goes as a script would play out. If you ever make the vid please share we all might be riding the same track.
As for the character grievance you have, it will have to just haunt you until you find your own peace with it. Parker is dead and dead men cannot defend themselves. Those who are loyal to him will remain loyal and those who are not will not be. Merry Thanksgiving!!! Nice ideas, but not factual. All the alternate techniques are just as flawed. For example you use the back knuckle abdomen strike in Twin Kimono- USELESS!!!
Watch two guys on the line in a football game- that is how people really push and grab. Your techniques will fall apart when attempted. But don’t believe me- just resist and watch the techniques fall apart. And I mean RESIST- like in a real fight.
Do not gently lay your hands on the guys chest and stand there while you destroy him with his blessing. Like 30 years ago we did a charity demo for an injured guy. All the Kenpo people there asked “why don’t you use Kenpo techniques in the demo?” They knew we had studied Kenpo. The response was simple- “we have actually hit each other and resisted them and they do not work.” They were shocked. To digress as to how deep the BS goes- Think of Mills comment that Ed Parker was Jumped by 5 sailors and beat 5 guys armed with knives and clubs in 5 seconds- REALLY!!!! That is the type of idiocy I am talking about. So let’s break it down: 1.
5 sailors- how would he know they were sailors? If on leave they almost never wear uniforms and I believe Utah is short on naval bases. 5 guys with knives- Paul Vunak is known for street fights. He is also a knife expert. I have been at his seminars where he discusses knives- 1 guy is a nightmare, 2 guys almost impossible, 3 you’re dead. Please do not even attempt to compare Parker to Vunak, and that is on so many levels.
7 seconds for the fight- who timed it? That comment is absurd. As long as people keep spouting tales of false bravado their students are at risk. As to the techniques and shifting to another one, who cares? So you transfer from one bad technique to another bad technique. I find it mystifying that people do not look at say clutching feathers and start laughing. And in a real street fight you do not have time to switch- FIGHT’S ON.
Have you ever had a real street fight? The mats are not the street.
As Bruce Lee was saying before he died- “Wake up.” Mast MA students are in a cult like coma. How do people follow Chosun Ninja or Freddie Lee? And I was there- I though Ed was a God. I just knew all his stuff worked, until I got into the ring and after I saw a Kenpo guy get owned in a real fight in Portland, OR.
Thanks for the holidays wishes, and man I MISS Turkey Day (my favorite holiday bar none). I haven’t lived in America for a long time. So ahve a great Xmas and a happy New Year. There are several videos of Bruce Lee sparring- and full-contact with gear against Dan Inosanto. I believe you made reference to the fact that if Twin Kimono does not work you go to Hooking Wings? Also a very weak to useless technique. You see in Kenpo you are taught that I will do A, and that will make you do B- BS.
You never know what a person will do when hit. I was teaching a PFS class in Ridgecrest, CA.
A guy I was ground fighting with spun with a elbow and busted my nose all over my face. I was bleeding profusely- like a faucet, I didn’t even know I was hit or bleeding until people asked me to stop.
This A to B to C to D idea is absurd. There are far too many variables. Life is too short to argue over what will never be settled. Everyone believes his this is the best or that is the best, but all systems are derived from one pond. Daruma Buddha Boddihatsiva Brahman priest. Shorin Ryu equals Shaolin equals, Qui Na, equals, Kung Fu, Kempo Okinawa equals Japanese Kara Te. Silat is derived from Hokkein Gung Fu, and was influenced by South Malay peoples, who had there own fighting methods, Silat Seni Gayong, which influenced Kali Phillipines, Kenpo was derived from Kung Fu Fukien, but each culture had some of it’s own methodology.
Kento became Kempo, Chi Na became 5 Schools of Kito Ryu ( Chen Gempai) and Jiu Jitsu which was taken to Brazil by Maeda who taught the Gracies and became Brazilian Style. All that has happened is in the United States the systems have been reassembled and called by systems of each choice. San Soo is Americanized (Since Woo was an American from Oakland), Jeet Kune Do is American (Jun Fan San Francisco), Kenpo is American (Mitose/ Gunso).
They were brought reassembled influenced by the teachers (Most Americans born here) using their Ancestral exposures to teach their forms of combat, but with an ideally American flair. They Parker, Okazaki, Kaihewalu, Lee Jun Fan, Han, De Thours, and more. All traded ideals, and realized that to truly understand it all you must “Discard the classical mess.” which means the 3 years of standing in horse stance to start, and foment cultural enthno centric Tongish style ideals. So instead of fighting this or that, rather say hey James Wing Woo was a big influence on E.P. Who in turn opened the United States to the Bruce Lee June Fan and the Asian World of Martial Arts to the World. Crenshaw: I “stumbled” onto the site and read your response to my previous posting on Ed Parker. Since the new year is just hours away, and I don’t want any “old baggage” in 2015 I felt compelled to response.
First, I am not an ass. Second, what I posted came from reliable sources, some who were there as part of Millo Savages corner. Milo had nothing but respect for the Martial Arts, but he and some of his people felt he was set up. Other posters have asked, now before we continue ANSWERwhy didn’t Master Parker take the fight?
Well, lets see. Chances are that it would have been a stand up slug fest which based on real fight experience and conditioning Milo may have won. And for Gene, according to you to say “I don’t care if he wears brass knuckles” I didn’t post to disrespect Parker, just thought the topic needed to be addressed. As for street fights.
I’ve worked in biker bars, hip hop night clubs, and discos like Valentinos. I know what works and what doesn’t on the street. I’ll put up my street MA experiences against ANYBODY because I’ve lived through it. Very few, if any MA Master regardless of style would have an easy go against 2, let alone 4 or 5 •. Monfongo, I don’t read this site any longer. I do get notifications of posts like yours so I am responding.
FIRST, I don’t have to “get reports from someone in one of the fighter’s corners. So were some of my students at the time, so don’t blow second hand smoke to perpetuate myths. There are enough eyewitnesses still above ground to verify what I wrote. THE MATCH OCCURRED EXACTLY AS I STATED IT. As to why a 77 year old would extend a challenge, (it is now actually 78) I’ll admit it is out of character, that is true; but my friend, brother and instructor was slandered on these pages by a cowardly know nothing pretending to be a great warrior but proving out of his own words that he knew nothing of the origins of the art he claimed to have taught. The “Commercial” art taught in Haole supported schools only bear a passing similarity to the original art Ed Parker Sr.
There are only a handful of us left that lived through the training that gave birth to the Parkerism, “To hear is to disbelieve, to see is to doubt; but to FEEL is to be convinced. Before the rise of the commercial studio, Ed Parker did a lot of “convincing.” I really wanted to end this year on a conciliatory note; however, you betrayed your profound ignorance once again by referencing (if I understood you correctly) MMA practitioners as the ultimate warriors. You clearly don’t understand what ED PARKER TAUGHT.
I have great respect for mixed martial artists. They are well trained, extraordinarly fit athletes. They compete in one of the most rugged sports in the world. BUT IT IS STILL A SPORT! There are rules!
What Parker taught before the requirement of pleasing American sensibilities became a factor, was LIFE AND DEATH, THE QUICK AND THE DEAD. If an attacker rushes you for a takedown and you sidestep, rip his eyes out with a claw hand and sever the nerves at the base of his skull with a hand sword, the refs would most likely frown a little. And if one of those agile athletes did get you down and went for a submission hold and you, to save you life, tore his throat out with your teeth; or if the MMA expert applied a leg strangle and you used your teeth to open his femoral artery, you might face disqualification. The same as you might for slamming the heel of both hands on both temples before driving the nasal bone into his brain. “But that’s not “FAIR” you might bleat.
And in mixed martial arts or a “fair fight,” you’d be right. It is against the rules. In what Ed Parker taught there are NO RULES!
Case in point: Just a few weeks ago 74 year old Tony Martinez (One of my first Black Belts who now runs his own studio) was peacefully eating breakfast at a local cafe. He was thinking about the day ahead and was staring off into space. A huge Tongan (Is there any other Kind?) took offense, He thought Tony was staring at him. Tony stands maybe 5’4”, grey hair, a little guy.
The Tongan grabbed Tony by the shirt front and yelled, “Who you staring? Still seated, Tony twisted the attacker’s hand with his left, swept his leading leg and as the attacker’s face smashed into the table with his right hand Tony hit him at the base of his skull with a hammer fist. Blood and scrambles eggs flew everywhere.The fight was over in between two and three seconds.
It’s that reaction to the unforeseen that Parker taught; not a stylized combat sport. By the way, the police came and were going haul both men to the slammer when the waitress spoke up and said, ” the little guy didn’t do anything, the big guy just attacked him.” Don’t ever make the mistake of thinking little old grey haired men are easy pickings.
There are still a significant number of us greybeards around who were trained in the original Kenpo. Life and Death; the Quick and the Dead. It may not be beautiful by modern standards; but history proves that what Ed Parrker taught is lethal.
Hopefully, this will be my last post. I come from the “old school” cloth of street Martial Arts. While I have trained in MMA and handled myself pretty well in both “stand up” and ground against ranked fighters who are much younger(yupI’m 64)street effective training is what I do.
Like I also pointed out to several well known Brazilian “ground” specialists, 90% of their submission techniques can be countered with biting. Now, back to the subject at hand.
So far you have insulted me on this forum by calling me as ass and second hand smoke blower AKA as a “blowhard”. You sound like a JO! Furthermore, I will stick to my opinion that if Parker fought Milo instead of La Bell, Parker would have had his clocked cleaned.
Oh, by the way that would have happened in a street fight as well. I am not interested in reading about your lawsuits or “verbal diarrhea” with other posters here. But I give Robert Libby my “thumbs up” for having the “cohones” to speak up and I find his version of things VERY credible.
Unless you are in stellar shape and have the mental fortitude to back up your childish bravado cease the bad mouthing and “chest thumbing”, you are not as “bad a dude” as you think. Lastly, I KNOW there are plenty of senior Martial Artists that are proficient enough to handle most self defense situations. I have never and would never underestimate a gray haired, grandfatherly “type”. With that, go sit in your rocking chair and watch some All in the family reruns:–) •.
Dear Monfongo, I would first like to apologize for being sucked into some bad behavior, but I get really pissed when people infer that I am a liar. But I agree with what you have said. You mentioned biting.
I, like you, also use eye gouging and finger breaking. Own a man’s thumb and you own him. I also am very concerned about people shelling out good money to learn useless martial arts from teachers that have never fought, and that is street or full contact. I urge anybody out there to watch the Joe Rogan Show with Bas Ruten on “fake martial arts.” Very fact based and funny. AND A HAPPY NEW TEAR TO ALL •. Libby: Thank you for acknowledging my posts.
I believe EVERYTHING you have said and although we have never met, feel confident that you have the experience, expertise, and skills to back up ALL your claims. Martial Artists like you and I, who come from the same cloth and somewhat similar backgrounds and beliefs can sense that unique brotherhood. Like you, I also believe in the importance of good, solid boxing skills. Case in point, I not only had Milo Savage as my trainer, I had other well known former fighters turned trainers work with me as I went through the tough ranking tests overseen by my late, great, but non commercial Shihan. Keep in touch, and all the best always.
I am here if and when you need me. Now let me set our buddy Mills straight one last time. Mills, For the record, I am NOT Robert Libby. I am Dan “Monfongo” Santini. It seems like MY last post mellowed you out a bit, and that’s a good thing.
My opinion should be respected, as should I. Then, regardless of our differences that respect can be mutual. For way too long, decades to be exact many Martial Arts “legends” have been living off of “hype”. I ran into one of my older uncles this morning.
He’s going to be 80 in March:–( Then, I thought of you Mills:—-( And ya know, I felt kind of bad Understand, that your take or version on Martial Arts history is not the be all, end all. People you may have never heard of pride themselves on their honesty, credibility, and dedication to the Martial Arts just as much, if not more so than the legends and pioneers.
It’s been quite interesting Mills. As I said, Mr. Santini, Have a good life. I was a little amused by your final comments the importance of boxing, etc.
Tony Martinez Sr., The little grey haired 74 year old guy who took out the Tongan bully in a couple of seconds Tony was a Golden Gloves champion when he first came into my studio in Salt Lake City. He didn’t think what Ed Parker taught (and I taught) would work eitheruntil he got on the matt. Inch per inch and pound per pound I’d still put 74 year old Tony Martinez up against anyone, not in Kenpo, 25 years his Juniorand many Kenpoists, for that matter. But then, Tony mastered what Ed Parker taught. Oh, yes, he also worked as a bouncer, years ago. He was all action, not mouth.
It seems to me I heard, somewhere, that Ed Parker had a little boxing background as well. Oh, well Cordially, mc •. During my research on Kenpo I was guided to this site and became interested enough to read the comments and on going debate on Kenpo and most important Edmund Parker. Understandably, his students and followers are going to be upset with the general overview on Mr. But, it’s true.
Parker was overweight and out of shape. While he could move extremely fast for a big man and was more than capable of DEFENDING himself, his poor condition and lack of training would be very DETRIMENTAL to a face off face against even an untrained opponent who was strong and physically fit. Parker isn’t the only recognized name or Master to fall into this catagory either. While it may be disrespectful to bring up these issues many years after his passing, my question is would it have made any difference if he were alive to hear it? Parker would have been in a compromising situation.
Faced with the possibility of having to defend his name and honor in such horrible physical condition. Kenpo is a beautiful art, but it’s real effectiveness is miniscule. I knew Edmund very well.
And I feel more than qualified to comment on this matter. A pioneer and legend who deserves the utmost respect for his accomplishments, but sadly not his physical condition or training dedication. Lou Angel, Bob White, and countless other masters of the art; and eventually YOU, Wes, will suffer the ravages of time and encroaching old age. Does that make their contributions of no value?
Does that justify younger punks denigrating his accomplishments in order to build up their own reputations, so they suppose? If you are of that mind set I pity you. To you Michael Angelo was a has-been painter, Charles Dickens was a reprobate scribbler and the only things of value are yet to be discovered. Virtually every Martial Arts Instructor worthy of the name stands and builds on Ed Parker’s creative Genius.
Have they moved on? That is precisely what Ed taught. He gave his students both the tools and the insight to create. He didn’t create robots his goal was to create “thinking warriors.” I trained under him in his prime.
There has never been a more fierce, or deadly warrior. Of course, his most grievous fault was that he listened to the council of his enemies and ignored the council of his friends. Now that he is gone, we hear much from those who pretended to know him but only had the courage to speak against him once he was gone. You remember him with white hair and significantly overweight; I remember him as an athletic combatant with a black mane, set off with a genetic forelock, shock of white hair that was the signature of his youth. Your memories are of the ravages of age; my memories are of the creative fires of youth.
So Mills refers to the ravages of time- Ed was like 42 when I chose him off. I am 63 and still train and teach. Jimmy Woo who is like 90, and who Ed stole his second book from still teaches. I have never denigrated Ed to build up my own reputation- I have a good one and do not need that Hawaiian fraud to bolsterme up. His 2 references I believe are to tournament fighters, not street fighters. All of Mills’ references to great thinkers like Michelangelo and Dickens are merely smoke screens to cover his bullshit.
He states that EVERY MARTAIL ARTIST WORTHY OF HIS NAME STANDS AND BUILDS ON HIS NAME. Benny Urquidez said “he never showed me a damn thing.” Larry Hartsell called him”a Kenpo clownl.” The Gracie brothers have probably never heard of him.
He says that people never did yhese things when he was alive- he was breathing when I chose him off- then he behind Lelani’s skirt. Mills calls him a warrior. Who did he fight? Not me or anybody else. Mills claims his fault was believing enemies. His fault was surrounding himself with suck ups and burning his true friends in favor of ass kissers.
Mills says he was a fierce warrior- he would not fight me. Mills is a provable liar. In February I will have a video up- I have a promose from a friend to help me do it. I will show 1. Why tneydo not work 2. How to fix them 3. And why some are beyond repair 4.
Why do to these techniques Ed knew nothing abot fighting, counters, body mechanics, or blocking. A good video is about 2 hours per video, despite the claims of those tnat never made one. Many of yne ideas will be quite basic. People like Monfongo will understand exactly what I am talking about and showing. Many brainwashed followers will simply keep following the same old ways like anesthetized cattle.
Here is a list of Kenpo people that can fight: Larry Hartsell Dan Inosanto Scott Loring (a true freak of nature) Steve Sanders Vic Leroux Carl Schalio George Quinones “Big” John Henderson Bob Eisele Tom Howard Albert Cornejo Paul Edward Dalton Stromin’ Norman Pattiz Russ Feinman Chuck Epperson Bruce Epperson I apologize to any that I have left out. As teenager Kenpo saved my life, but by people like Scott Loring, Paul Dalton, Russ Feinman, Norm Pattiz, Albert Cornejo, and Larry Hartsell.
I will be eternally grateful. Ed was merely a visitor to a once great school. After I post the videos please feel free to ask questions on other techniques. Please the name, and if I do not know it by name p,ease post a video. Unlike Ed I can analyze it and tell you if it works or not. To get this out of the way I am old, I ahve white hair, I am fat, bit I can still bang and walk around tneb,ock without gasping for airl •.
I understand from the war stories of Frank Trejo, that Ed Parker (as any self respecting Hawaiian would be); loved to eat. As for his fighting abilities I refer readers to Lee Wedlake or Skip Hancock to research Master Parker’s skills. He visited their schools attended their sponsored seminars and was highly respected. Another source would be Mike Pick. All of the above instructors listed credit Mr.
Parker with their skills. Instead of throwing grenades at Kenpo, go train with them for two years and decide if Kenpo sucks or not.
My feeling is that the problem lies with the grey matter between your ears. As with any skill set, it’s not the body of knowledge that’s the problem, it’s the practitioner. Jeff Speakman recognized that in the early 90s.
And cautioned the attendees to be worthy of the rank around their waist. I want to add one more thiught. I am basically from Los Angeles. I usually ride very fast motorcycles like Kawasaki ZX-9Rs or ZX-11s.
So abig problem was bike thefts by organized gangs. We were sitting around one day discussing this. So as I teach martial arts some asked for my opinion.
My advice was call the police. These are people that may have either numbers or weapons. And in LA if you go after them and shoot them in your garage you could be in serious trouble, and a lawyer could be far more expensive than the bike, and we all have insurance-now to the main point. A vey attractive young woman was there, and she rode a nice bike. So she says “I would put on my tobak and go out there and kick their asses.” She was 105 lbs wet. So I started laughing and made a comment about her maybe getting raped.
So she got really andry w7th me and feot I had insulted her, her art, and her “master.” So I said “you’re really serious!” She was enraged and stormed off. This is what I mean by bad ideas getting people killed. Crenshaw, What compelled you to chastise me? My commentary about Edmund were done with respect. You actually made my blood boil.
Let me give you a legitimate reason to “rip me a new one”. Parker was an “index writer” of Kenpo techniques. And the hundreds of his American Kenpo requirements were there for money. In his “youth” his silky black “mane” could not compensate for his lack of training, fitness, or effectiveness. How would Edmund in his prime faired against Joe Lewis, John Natividad, Ed Daniels, even Counte Dante? Look, I get it!
You are standing up for your instructor and friend, but your coming off sounding more like he was the love of your life. I meant no disrespect to Edmund but your chastising me pushed my buttons.
I’ll say it loud and clear. Master Edmund K. Excelled at writing made up techniques on index cards, promoted a nice tag tournament called the Internationals, loved to “grub”, was overweight, and coukd throw for 15-30 seconds before gasping for air.
However, his name and size earned him more respect than his actual abilities. No bs, just the truth. After all, the truth only bends one way. Let me add my 2 cents by posting in poetry fashion. American Kenpo is effective and great, like it’s creator so let me clear the slate.
Ed Parker was an honorable man, a true Martial Arts Master my feuding friends. Father time makes us all old and gray, and some gain some inches so what I say. Ed Parker may have been heavy but his abilities sure were not lame. Slander and defame, it’s a crying shame for those in the know can tell all you doubters Ed Parkers skill set was not a game. Let’s give him respect and honor the man.
His positive legacy will live on forever in this great land. To answer that, and from somebody that knew him and worked for him, your little poem is WRONG!!!! Feinstein points out his techiques fighting efficacy were “miniscule”, and from videos one can see his skills were non-existent. I do not feel that a man who stole a book from a fine man like Jimmy W. Woo deserves respect, nor do I feel that a man who threatens my beginners deserves respect. To “slander” means to lie, and many of us have not lied.
Have you ever even met the man? Let me add one more point as to how silly MA can get.
When Ed would do one of his little “bursts” his hair would shake or vibrate. So some Kenpoists came up with a whole “scientific concept” about this called “vibrational transfer.” REALLY!!! Just more crap and pseudoscience. Also, my friend and I will start filming on February 15th.I will post the videos to Youtube. They will be done in a series. Is there a time limit to Youtube?
Each one should be 15 to 20 minutes long. I will do “the Five Count” first as it is a Kenpo mainstay, but as practiced absurd; then how to fix it and with a much better ending. Then the side headlock technique, but I do not know the Kenpo name (Monfongo, I do believe you will enjoy my method for getting out).
And ask why you do it the way you do it in short form 3 when one of the main weaknesses was agreed upon like 35 years ago, but never changed. After that Twin Kimono, a truly disadtrous technique, but I will show alternate methods for a front double lapel grab.
The “back breaker- it starts off brilliantly and then goes to shit, but I will show better options and its weaknesses. Thundering Hammers- has so much potential if done correctly, but as done ridiculous on so many levels. I will also try to get in Clutching Feathers and Triggered Salute. Clutching Feathers is NUTS and non-fixable, triggered Salute starts great and then goes to shit.
Duribg the videos I will show some basic ideas on how to survive a real fight by not injuring yourself as when you punch a guy in the head and break your hand- a real fight ender for you. If you have requests please send them to the Youtube site. Mills, Your input would be very helpful. You have the background to correct this person called Mr.
Apparently, everything we thought we know about Mr. Parker is wrong.
He couldn’t kick, can’t punch, can’t hold his hands properly, threatened beginners, lied and cheated Mr. Woo, backed down from a challenge, hosted a fake karate tournament called the ‘Internationals’, taught bogus techniques that don’t work, insults any long time students of his (this includes you) by calling them cronies. But rest assured he is going to post improvements to kenpo such as Clutching Feathers, Thundering Hammers, Back Breaker, and others on You Tube sometime in February. We can’t wait to see his new and improved fighting moves. I’m guessing he won’t, but if he does, it will be adjustments that you and anyone else with half a brain in the martial arts, already do.
Sorry Steve-this is snibb. I have only a fraction of my posts going up so I figured if I put down a famous name I might be able to get through.
It looks like it worked but it’s not really Paul Mills. This website is heavily censored so that only the most decisive posts seems to be making it through. My son did run some software however and figured out that Libby, Monfongo, survy, and Morgan are all the same guy.
It appears that our boy Libby lips seems to be posting and then reposting under different names to drive traffic to his website. You talk about a fraud! We also don’t know for sure, but it appears that the trash(Libby)is not in Europe as he states but is somewhere right here in the US of A. Libby, Geez, you must be seriously angry person. You can’t even carry on a debate in a civil way. Yelling (by all caps) at a dude writing poetry? I bet you kick your dog too.
Seriously, though, I look forward to your new and improved kenpo moves on You Tube. Be careful not to change the timing, prefix, or suffix with any added moves, or rearrange, or delete cause if you do, you’ll be doing Ed Parker Kenpo by using his alteration principles. If using the lead arm sucks for you, then don’t use it! That’s called deleting, (part of the alteration principles) Still kenpo. Unless you jump up 7 feet high, and land on the attackers shoulders, that’s not in kenpo, We’ll have to give you that one. You mention you’ll be starting out with the 5 count technique, by that, you must mean Five Swords. (Hint: you don’t need to block, just take the fight to the attacker) Mike Pick does this very effectively.
You say you taught at Ed Parker’s school and he was never there. That’s called delegating. He most likely was out of town sharing his knowledge and growing the system. If not, he could be homewith his family, So what? If I was running the school in his absence I would have considered it an honor to be the head instructor. When you tape yourself, we don’t need 15 minutes of your verbal analysis, just tape the techniques as you do them for everyone to be enlightened.
You keep raising straw man arguments about things and controversies that have been fought decades ago. For example, The weakness of kenpo cross over manuevers, then you refer me to a blogpost by a kungfu guy in Australia, who posts a video of his Tiger/Crane form, which has nearly all crossover foot work. The blog then has a video of oriental karate tournament where one person backs up, and gets his legs tied up trying to retreat. Sorry for him, but what about the cross over moves of the late great Kenpo man Tom Kelly, where he sweeps his opponents to the ground and scores?
(On You Tube by the way) This guy then spends a lot of time criticizing the open hand position of Ed Parker in various martial stances. Don’t you think for any given moment Parker couldn’t make a fist if needed? And your blogger friend lumps Ed Parker’s hand position with Peter Sellers fake karate hands in Pink Panther, Hell, Ed Parker probably told him to do that for laughs! Ed Parker was in a few of those films as an assassin.
You should watch those Pink Panther films, the laughter will do you good. Speaking of the poor stances of Ed Parker, sorry man didn’t see any, unless you referring to the demo from the Internationals where he systematically takes out his team. It’s a DEMO!, not a real fight, its a pre arranged display of you could do, not what may actually happen.
I’m defining what a demo is to you. Defending a position you should’ve known about years ago. (what a Demo is) Your constant insults to Mr.
Crenshaw, dude, he was on the mat with Mr. Parker before you learned to ride a bike. As for this book you claim Mr.
Parker stole, You must be referring to the SOCK. (Secrets of Chinese Karate) A stripped down version of Two Man set is drawn there. I have a copy, it’s not for instruction, but for basic history and to generate interest in the martial arts. You really think Ed Parker made a lot of money with that book? If Woo was so cheated was there a law suit? How do you know Ed Parker didn’t pay him on his own?
Get over this anger man, and yes I’ve been a few fights, and I did do fairly well, but as you said, punching heads hurts your knuckles. Mine were sore for a week, but I won the fight. I’ve been hit by Mike Pick, and tested in front of Skip Hancock and taught self defense at the college level.
I have put in the time needed to attain my goals I’ve set, But for you, it is never enough. I served in the military, US Army, but you’ll say, why not the Marines, I attained the rank of Sergeant, you’ll say, how come not a Captain or General? I can do 40 push ups, that sucks, why not 100? I can swim, you’ll say, well, why haven’t you swam the English Channel? Your arguing is endless circular nonsense.
You bang the podium about fake martial arts and artists. I get that we as instructors have a responsibility to pass on the knowledge so that our students are worthy of the rank they attain. Some people take martial arts to the ring and compete in MMA, boxing, whatever; others like the work outs and the confidence knowing a martial art gives them.
So what if people don’t fight full contact, its not for everyone. And I caution that if a student did everything shown in Back Breaker, they will go to prison. Kenpo is a sliding scale man. You can take it to what ever level you want, military special forces, full contact, or 3 times a week, and a tournament on Saturday.
A little more here- you say “how do you not know that Jimmy didn’t pay him off.” You classless accusatory little fuck. I do nit qgree wuth Jimmy’s system, but he is a man of great integrity who loves his students. For you to insult this 90 year old oegend sh8ws what a typical Kenpo shithead you are. So I am confusedl.
A lit of videos say Mike Pick. I get one guy that looks my age with a bushy trey and blafk beard. The others have a ckean cut guy who looks like chemistty teacher. Which one is Pick? In either case my wufe said “honey, why do all these Kejpo always jyst Talk? When you teach you bite oeople and throw yhem around and actualky hut them.” Whoever I am seeing it is moer EPAI bullshit. And some comnented that they woukf gett killed in a street fight.
So when and where? I look at these comments and question your sanity. Skip Hancock “taught at a college level”. Are you nuts all the time? 2hat university offers MA as a degree?Then you talk about Tom Kelly sweeping a guy-in aNON-CONTACT TOURNAMENT!!! Then you accuse me of kicking my dog.
I train dogs. I yave a 1/2 Rottweiler that worships the ground I walk on. A guy heard me talking about my dog. So he said to my friend “he would die for his dog?” My friend said “he would.” My wife once said “who do you love more-me or Kobe?” I said “you haven’t saved m5 life 6 times.” She knew I was kidding. You are so nuts that you would need 10 years of therapy to tie your shoes. You make insane generalizations abiut somebody you have never talked to and about a con artidt losthed by many.
So to be blunt FUCK YOU YOU PRISSY LITTLE SCHOOL GIRL. You are a typical Kenpo clown. Same deal- when and where?
Let’s have the metal meet the meat. I am 63 years old, have broken 30 or more bones, had 12 orthopaedic surgeries, and died twice and bet I can kick your candy ass all over the place. No rules, no cups, no bullshit. Judt you and me in your school mano a mano. Put up ir shut up. And your ideas about the back breaker are absurd. So when and where?
And yes I want to video ut. You call Ed never being their “delegating”-no it’s calked lazy. You have every bullshit pseuro defense I have ever heard. So when and where? What makes me angry is jerk offs like you that pose as martial artists and are frauds.
If you served in the US ARMY I salute. All posts in the US armed services are honot0rable- whether it be cook or laundry, it is a team.
I know peope that blast Chuck Norris because he served in an air force cargo unit. I defend his service in that without cargo the guys on the ground die. It is a team effort. You know nothing about me. I have had over 100 street fights- 90% were defending other people (I currently live in one of yhe most dangerous countries in the world, I have been here for almost 14 years). So who the fuck are you?
When and where? You praise a man you have probably bever met. I saw his actions. He was a fraud. So when and where? Ok, so now we’ve stopped discussing kenpo, to challenging each other, is this like a duel or something? So, you would spend extra money diverting your schedule to fly into Tallahassee just to punch me out to prove your kenpo is better than my kenpo?
This sounds like a bad movie. Just post those videos you keep promising, we really want to see how you’ve improved Back Breaker, Thundering Hammers, Clutching Feathers, etc. I’m curious to see how you modified them to fit your combative reality. Is there anyone in Kenpo you respect? Hey Monfongo.
I guess according to Snibbs we are now getting married. I had better divorce my wife first. Also, where are you located? I looked up your name up and there are a lot of you.
I did see a slight reference to you with the Inosanto Academy. And thanks so much for the support.
As to Steve Shaffer- you and Mills, and several others have called me a liar, a sociopath and a fool. Well, I am smart enough not to do Kenpo anymore. All you people do is give each other a Kenpo handjob and talk about how great you are while you pass around high ranking belts like they’re popcorn. In the old days you wouldn’t have lasted 5 seconds with us. There was a plaque in the wall of the Santa Monica school that said “rest in peace Jim Demecke”- Scott Loring went after him and missed, but his fist went clean through the wall. Another time Scott was sparring with Tom Howard- Tom rolled into a ball to get away and Sott bombarded Tom with hooks and upper cuts to the body, and said “covering up won’t do you a bit of good.” In an interschool tournament Bob Eisele was sidekicked right in the face and got his front teeth knocked- he spit his teeth out and kept on coming.
We jumped him to save his teeth for him and made him stop and go to the dentist to save the teeth. Tom Kelly (the Catholic priest, not the Utah one) would fight Dewey Cruise and blood would be flying (both were basically just boxers). Larry Hartsell would drag me into the mats or back area, and while wearing GI combat boots teach me, and would kick me with combat boots. We would turn the lights off and just have side light from the street, then we would do scenarioes of 1 on 1, 1 on 2 and people got banged up. Do your people train like that? NO FUCKING WAY!!!
I gave you a long list of Kenpo people I respect. And I’ll tell you why: I respect Steve Sanders as he was in the USMC and served honorably, and was a Sheriff. I also trained a bit at the Black Karate Federation under Steve and Donnie- great guys. I respect Scott Loring for his raw abilities and intellect, and he was great teacher, but he made us fighters. But right around the ear;y 70s Kenpo went to shit.
People bowing to us like we were GODS, forced to wear their belt knot at the side of their hip, and watching it become a cult. I was in a local LA supermarket with my girlfriend.
A Kenpo green belt jumped in front of me, performed the very elaborate and long Kenpo salute, and then asled “is there anything I can do for you Mr. Libby?” I of course said “like what?” My girlfriend asked if he was nuts, and he embarassed me, and made a fool of himself.
I was at the Urquidez Bros school and a Kenpo brown belt walked in and did the same thing- Arnold almost threw him out, it was embarassing. I always said some Kenpo guys can fight.
In Chico, CA there are the Epperson Bros. Bruce Epperson had a squabble with another school. So Bruce went down to the school to fight the guy. The guy wore body armor, Bruce didn’t. Bruce dismantled the guy, but never once used a Kenpo technique.
He used boxing hands with kicking. While in Chico we all had breakfast with Bill Wallace. And I was discussing the old days and how laughable tournamants had become- no standards, no form, power, or focus. Bill agreed 100% and the Eppersons and others were somewhat shocked by this. And Chuck can fight too. But as I look at this you have also referred to me as a “sociopath” and a clown. That nobody should listen to me.
No, they should listen to you and your other Kenpo tough guys. And here is why-he hit him with a back knuckle, that’s Kenpo. He hit him with a right cross, that’s Kenpo.
You teach that a technique is a series of basic moves. Yet none of your patterns as practiced wotk in that technique pattern. Sure, when you do Five Knives you look swell while he stands there and does nothing- very impressive. I too can hit and punch an unmoving object. Also, people hit back, and for real.
I will merely walk into your schol and as they say “own you.” But I will not hit you or kick you. Watch the video where a Gracie DESTROYS a Kenpo black belt in like 38 seconds. Then does it again. You’ll see that known Kenpo techniques could even come close to working, no eye shots, no Charging Ram as he took him down, and Charging Ram is the Kenpo defense for a tackle, just a Kenpo fool getting owned.
Good thing for him it was not for real. “Fomments?” “I do jot like Mills” And here you were a while ago telling us how we Americans(like you)are illiterate! Listen up you ingrate free-loading faggot-it’s too late because of your age to get some additional education, but at least learn how to use spell checker.
Even a moron like you might be able to figure it out. I’ve said nothing about Steve, but you certainly did.
As a matter of fact, I saw his video (unlike yours )and thought it was excellent. Who said anything about goats Nimrod? You threaten everybody in here, cuss at them and you can’t take being called a homo? You want me banned because of that?
After what you’ve said to people? Here’s an idea- since you are the one runnnng this site why don’t you just ban me cupcake? You are such a stud trash(Libby)! Where’s the video clowny? What’s that libby(monfago?) Vito who? That one of your imaginary goon friends!
Easy to spot you post as others because of your writing style. You-like the cupcake-tell us how bad you are,how you stay in top top shape, threaten, etc.
The other way to tell is your stupidity. I wasn’t denigrating Nevada at all by my comment(that would be “fomment” for you Einstein). Are you telling me that your dollar will go farther in Nevada than it will in Florida? You should have stayed in school past the 3rd grade Fruitty. Maybe a little less time in the weight room and more time staying current would serve you well monfago/Libby/trash. One last question: Where’s the video clowny? And if you are a different person-same question-where’s the video clowny?
You disgusting excuse for a human being. I detest your comments about my “goon” friends. Unlike you parasite, I don’t “lose” my friends just because they may follow a certain lifestyle. Is your wife a transvestite?
Oh, sorry your “girlie boy” wears panties? Slob, what type training regiment do you follow? Oh that’s right you follow the Ed Parker program.
You write drills on index cards and use your mind to embed the material into your Albert Einstein subconscious, right? Are your teeth as nice as his were? Do you walk around without bathing for week’s at a time like he did as you think up inventions? Your writing style and comments tells me you feel that your intelligence level is above mine and Robert Libby. Snibby are you a closet dumb f—? What are you talking about? You’ve been big-talking about a video for almost a year.
And no-your little trick of recording a video with trash( Libby)won’t prove anything. I’m not that stupid. All you’ll do is take 1 of your 2 old geezer students that give it to you up the rear and say-“see- me and trash are 2 different people.” Nice try though.
And no, I’m not interested in fighting your old lard butt because I don’t want to get sued when you get hurt-even with all the gear on. You’re such a stud monfago/ Libby! Where’s the video clowny? Don’t worry about me getting hurt and then sueing you. I will sign paper work so your off the hook. But, I’m not getting hurt Snibbs. It’s put up punk out time.
And, I’m as serious as a heart attack about this. Maybe, we could have Robert Libby referee.
I hold my own even now against pro boxer’s/kickboxer, and do OK rolling around with guys half my age. I’m not a tough talking paper tiger buddy. Street or sport I can handle myself very well. As a Martial Artist who is huge on respect I feel bad it’s come to this, but I’ve never allowed ANYBODY to get away with lip service and I’m not starting now. Yes or no, what’s your decision so that we can start working on the particulars?
I’m not going to talk trash against you if you choose to step out. Sometimes, it takes a real man to realize when it’s best not to take chances. No lectures, just a yes or no. You know what’s great trash(Libby/monfaggot/potato face, Morgan, Survy, etc.?) I get to unplug from this discussion and never hear from you ever again. I get the last word! You’re too stupid to figure that one out, I’m sure.
It’s obvious that you’re a fake, fraud, chose your word. You’ve got nothing-other than an elementary education with the immaturity to match. You don’t like what somebody says, and old Libby/potato face, etc. Will come and find you and beat you up! Oh boy, that scares me! You come in here and trash Ed Parker, Mills, and everybody else.
The exception is when you keep re-posting as different people. Nobody here likes you. You huff, and you puff, but you can’t blow anything down. You can’t even produce a 2 minute video clowny! Even a queer-bait like you should be able to figure that one out. Oh yes, it’s that shortness of education again!
I guess you will just have to live with that for the rest of your life. So, here is to me wasting a lot of time talking to a fag, posing as an expert on the martial arts, and Kenpo in particular. I won’t be asking for the video anymore clowny, because you can’t do it. You’re a pretender and everyone knows it.
And who knows, maybe you will get a visit from DHS. I did forward your threats of violence. I can’t find you, but they can if they choose.
Well you ingrate, uneducated, slurp from the public trough nincompoop, and big-talker, have a nice life. I sure wish I could have seen the video clowny.
My advice is to leave the homosexual lifestyle. I can understand how no woman would want you, but that doesn’t mean you have to be a lube master.
I’m sure you’re used to it. Bye bye potato face.
Well my apologies for that Carl. But in our defense when people call you a liar, when in fact you KNOW they are lying I react. Now let me answer your question in a different way. Americans always “deify” or “mystify” the martial arts. Here is an example- the 2 Lewis’s, Joe and Lennox. Joe Lewis, 6’0″ and 200lbs. Served honorably in the USMC as a radioman (VERY DANGEROUS JOB).
Wnet on to karate and kickboxing. He did well, but to be fair was very overrated. He was a tough guy who trained hard. But his fans have said things about him that are inaccurate- I am not accusing Joe of anything here.
HE is dead and died a credit to the arts. Lnnox Lewis- 6’5″ 245. Hit like a freight train ith 41 wins in 44 fights. The point to this is that Joe Lewis was always referred to as “lethal.” His “lethal” side kick, his “lethal” reverse punch. Lennox Lewis, who would mop the floor with JOe Lewis, was never referred to as lethal.
Joe Rogan once said “I learned how to do something really stupid really well (Tae Kwan Do).” The point to this is that when a young man plays Pop Warner fotball he is learning how to play football. When a young man learns how to play baseball or basketball he is learning how to play that sport. When a young woman or man does BJJ or judo they are learning to do it right, and how they will street fight or protect themselves or family members. When most of our youth learn 90% of the martial arts out there they are being conned.
To illustrate this point I will tell you about 2 incidents. One I was involved in, the other one my girlfriend, who was am ICU nurse, took care of the aftermath. I was in Portland, Oregon about 40 years ago. My acquaintance (I didn’t know him very well), a Kenpo black belt, got in a bar fight. HE nailed the aggressor perfectly with a tournament reverse punch. And like a tournament fighter he pulled his punch; then he got his clock cleaned.
But how could that happen? He had trophies, he was a KEnpo black belt? But he had never done full contact work. While living in Chico, CA while at university, a, I believe 4th. Degree in TKD got into a fight.
I heard he told the guy “I am a 4th degree black belt.” THe other guy wasn’t impressed. So the TKD guy goes for a head kick. The other guy steps in, grabs the guy by the hair and justs lays waste to the TKD black belt.
The TKD guy was at Enloe Hospital and was in jeopardy of losing his eye, or maybe just his vision. And his instructor was a guy that had “kicked the shit out of 5 Hellls Angels” in a bar brawl (reminds you of Mills’ story of Ed destroying 5 sailors with knives and clubs). This is the crap that can get you killed. So I am far more concerned about reality than some bad language.
I am far more conceren that our kids learn reality than a load of high priced BS that can get them killed. I am far happier that some of my students chose to run rather than fight as they were taught. That they never relied on BS and far fetched hallucinatory stories from liars. Sorry for the language. Who is this Squib guy?
Is he ranked in Kenpo? Why all the arguments and bashing on Kenpo and Ed Parker? What’s the difference if he won most or lost a few street fights? Let the man have his dignity in death. We ALL make mistakes and have done something that we regret, but trying to be better is all that counts.
Kenpo is a VERY effective Martial Art for the street. I am a 3rd in American Kenpo and 1st with the IKCA.
The IKCA would not tolerate any of this nonsense that’s for sure. Anyway, as for effective self-defense I challenge anyone on this forum to find a better self-defense system than the IKCA offers. While I do cross train in some grappling, I have found that the IKCA has everything I need and more when it comes to protection techniques.
So there is a very effective and compact Kenpo system that is readily available to anyone willing to come into this brotherhood with respect and an open mind. I do not know what the IKCA is. After Ed’s death there were a lot of splinter groups formed.
As to your comment about Kenpo being effective I would ask you to watch “Gracie fights Kenpo black belt. Garageband App Free Download there. ” The fight is over in like 37 seconds, and the Ken9o guy tried it again-same result. You mentioned Ed and a few street fights. I do not believe Ed ever had a fight as an adult. He ducked Milo Savage, he wouldn’t fight me, and he never taught nor trained.
I do not feel that walking around talking for 2 hours is teaching. In regard to Kenpo you will hear terms like “cult”, “Kenpo cranial swelling.” Dealing with a Kenpo student or instructor is like dealing with a religious psychotic, they always yave a but or an if, or some explanation or option that you just “don’t get.” Test your skills.
Go to an MMA school and see what happens. You will get your clock cleaned. Watch Joe R8gan with Bas Ruten on “fake martiao arts.” Good luck in your training.
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